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TOPIC: If it looks like a duck

Walter the baker If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #1

Walter the baker
... it probably is unless your name is Gill or Andrew

au.sports.yahoo.com/full-extent-melbourn...BKrGzhWdrTLhc3uHdwkR
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shane If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #2

shane
You think everything looks like a duck.
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bpurple If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #3

bpurple
Mmmmmmm. Duuuuck
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cookie If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #4

cookie
enough with the wise quacks
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DS If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #5

DS
If it looks like a duck it's probably a witch.
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Morgan If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #6

Morgan
Melbourne handled themselves poorly, and the AFL seemed to deliberately have their head in the sand, but I consider the bigger problem is a draft system that rewards losing. If you put in place incentives to lose in the form of higher picks eventually teams will try to lose.

They’ve made some tweaks to the priority picks system which is good, but all it would take is for there to be one clear generational talent to come through the junior ranks before teams at the bottom entertained the idea again. As it is fans of bad teams sometimes still hope their teams lose in the last few rounds, which is a clear sign the system still needs to be tweaked.
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shane If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #7

shane
The problem was they had a lot of gossip but no actual evidence that the team deliberately lost.

Many people would be very agreeable to the idea of 'playing the kids'. That's not putting your best team out on the ground and it's not playing with a mindset of winning the game but does that make it tanking?

It would depend on who's supporters you asked.
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R.Lyon said You Beaut

The_Yeti If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #8

The_Yeti
The AFL did what the AFL always does.

They manufactured a desired result for public consumption. Yes Melbourne deliberately lost games. That's been confirmed by the coach in question. It's also been confirmed that the AFL acted corruptly by hiding the truth of what had occurred.

Then to cap things off, they suspended some of those involved and fined the club for apparently 'not tanking'. Has there ever been a worse cover up of match fixing?
Egurls Suck!
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demo1, Raglan Matt, R.Lyon said You Beaut

shane If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #9

shane
I don't think you're using the word confirmed correctly.

Bailey never admitted to losing games deliberately. He claimed he felt pressured to do so. Chris Connolly denied everything. A few players said things about the vibe but the heart of the issues was from Brock McLean who kicked off the investigation with the claim that they were "putting development ahead of winning a game of footy".

Isn't that what Fremantle have been doing for a few years? Should Fremantle be deregistered for match fixing? Even when Fremantle were up, they'd send under strength teams to Tasmania and Queensland.

I would applaud the AFL if that was the standard they decided on but I think you'd have to give clubs fair warning because we'd lose half the league if you started throwing people out of the game for putting development ahead of winning a game of footy
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Raglan Matt If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #10

Raglan Matt
Shane, if the AwFL had hit us for tanking 4 years ago, we probably would not be in the situation we have been in for the last 3 years, continuing ad infinitum.
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hypen If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #11

hypen
Hang on that article referred to fake injuries to key players. That is actively tanking. There is no ambiguity in this they were trying not to win.

They're all guilty, there's only degrees of guilt here.

You can't equivocate playing the youngsters with a deliberate action to losing a football game. Its not the action that's relevant here Shane its the intent.
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shane If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #12

shane
Fremantle do that all the time. How often do you hear someone say that they're better off just resting the player for the end of the season so they come back fresh? Players are ruotinely sent for operations that could have been postponed. How many "Season" injuries do you see in the bottom teams compared to the top teams?

When you put these claims into the context of 'tanking happened - this is how it happened' then everything is dodgy. When you put it in the context of 'my team is doing a rebuild' the same things are considered reasonable.

So how is the AFL supposed to take action against Melbourne Football Club for tanking, or match fixing, without taking action against a huge raft of other clubs in the bottom half of the ladder, and a few in the top half as well because, Fremantle were well known for resting players before finals.
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut

The_Yeti If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #13

The_Yeti
I don't agree with your assessment, Shane.

from the article:

“What was said to me was, if I win games I would get sacked,” Bailey told investigators in 2012.

“I was threatened. Yeah, I didn’t like it. I think it was a terrible thing to be bullying and harassing not only me but the rest of the staff.

“Absolutely, I knew if we won those games, I felt that I would get sacked.”

Interviews conducted with 58 current and former Demons staff in 2012 revealed a number of troubling allegations.

This included senior figures in the football department admitting they had been specifically directed not to win any more than four games that season, as well as ‘fake injuries’ to keep certain players from being selected.


It is not as easy to dismiss those statements by comparing them to ongoing player development.

I would add a further complication. Betting on games has now been officially sanctioned, both by the authorities and the controlling body, the AFL. Where teams deliberately lose games, where does that cross over into fraud. Betting companies can stand to lose substantial sums as can punters. Other sports involving match fixing have resulted in prison terms for those involved because it is a form of fraud.

Playing young players for development reasons is just not the same as intentionally losing for draft picks.

ps. I do NOT endorse gambling on footy games, nor do i endorse any betting agency.
Egurls Suck!
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pollyanna If it looks like a duck 5 years 4 weeks ago #14

pollyanna
Maybe CC was bullied by Schwabby....um...hahaha, no probably not.
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shane said You Beaut