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TOPIC: Lyon Tells Ryan

Hamihill Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #43

Hamihill
Was there ever a time on Dockerland when the majority of people were happy with the coach and if so who was he?
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rogerrocks said You Beaut

darthmarto Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #44

darthmarto
Though hang about ...

If failure is feedback and you fail to heed the feedback, doesn't this lead to a continuous feedback loop which can only result in sustained success?
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Raglan Matt, Lewy Lewy said You Beaut

The_Yeti Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #45

The_Yeti
Darth, that sounds like one of Baldric's cunning plans
Egurls Suck!
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Corporal Agarn said You Beaut

CaptSnooze Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #46

CaptSnooze
In most industries, good leaders have a finite period in which to effect change, before their energy becomes blunted and they make way for a fresh face. In the EPL, that expectation goes to an extreme where senior coaches are never out of the gun. Even in our local A-League, Kenny Lowe was moved on quickly enough when fortunes took a temporary tumble and a fresh face was needed.
The AFL is no different. At any point in time, RoLy may be seen by another club as the right person for them. At Fremantle for the last 'n' years though, with supporters forking out their life savings to attend matches and the club mired in a protracted downturn - or rebuild if you like - hindsight shows it was a mistake to have offered him top dollars for 5 years with no get-out clause. I think Fremantle will turn the corner next season, but Ross has at most 2 years, possibly just one under the current remuneration.
Back on topic, recruiting has been good in recent years, now it's all about key players staying fit, emerging stars getting stronger and sticking tackles. Like jezza I look forward to a modern running game with Luke, Nathan and others playing to their strengths, and more work on basic skills including goalkicking. Whatever. Injuries are no longer an excuse in season 2019.
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Morgan, Corporal Agarn said You Beaut

freo00 Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #47

freo00
There can be no excuses from here on , none what so ever .
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The_Yeti Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #48

The_Yeti
No excuses?

Of course there can be excuses. Roly doesn't make players do things apparently.

So he always has excuses...or excusers anyway
Egurls Suck!
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DazzElle, Raglan Matt said You Beaut

Morgan Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #49

Morgan
I agree with that Capt.

Yeti, no-one is saying Lyon isn't responsible for anything. My view is just that his responsibility isn't all-encompassing. Quantifying responsibility is a mug’s game, but roughly, in any given season, I reckon responsibility for wins and losses falls something like this:

Players: 50%
Head Coach: 20%
Assistant Coaches: 15%
Fitness Staff and Medical: 10%
Football Manager: 5%

What is harder to know is who has responsibility for, say, a five-year block. Obviously, the players still have a role, but the list and growth of the players is the responsibility of the coach and the Footy GM. So, putting the players to the side, but taking the view that recruiting, retaining and developing players is what leads to winning games of football, I’d put the responsibility somewhere like:

Head Coach: 25%
GM of Footy: 25%
List Manager: 15%
Head of Fitness: 10%
Assistant Coaches: 10%
CEO: 10%
Board: 10%

Now, where do those responsibilities roll up to? I’m not sure exactly, but ultimately it’s up to the CEO and the Board to appoint the right key pillars, with the Footy GM responsible for filling out the remaining key football people. The role of the coach is a bit less-defined in that sense, but they obviously have a role to play in that, even informally.

The way people talk on here is that Lyon is 100% responsible for everything bad that happens, and 0% responsible for anything good. I don’t share that view. It takes a lot of people to win or lose footy games.

My speculative view as a fan is that our assistant coaches are below league average and have been for a while, that we’ve had some issues with our injury management, we missed on a run of late first-round picks, and that Lyon’s tendency towards defence hurts our scoring. I don’t think Lyon is our biggest concern, but I wouldn’t say he’s been a net-positive over the last few years either.

Given the GM and List Manager have gone, I would say that Lyon and Weber would feel pretty nervous about their positions this season. I think we have the tools to be a pretty good team, and assuming we can keep some key players on the field and kick goals finals should be a realistic aim. Anything short of that and I reckon more heads will roll.

I also know that no matter what happens next season, no-one’s view of Lyon will change much.
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goodie, Rhufus, R.Lyon said You Beaut

The_Yeti Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #50

The_Yeti
That's untrue Morgan.

Any time Roly gets criticised on here, you are generally among the first to claim it's not down to him but the responsibility lies elsewhere.

It's a bit rich complaining he gets no credit while you're insisting he gets no blame.

Simple facts...he's always been a very controlling person and insistent that things are done his way and only his way. When you do that, you wear it when things go badly and things have definitely been bad for a long time.

I don't rate the ass coaches all that highly either but it's a bit hard to judge fully when somebody else is calling all the shots
Egurls Suck!
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Raglan Matt, themagoos said You Beaut

Jezza Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #51

Jezza
The Slime was one minute away from disaster. Had it not been for a poor umpiring decision, Sheed doesn’t kick the winning goal. But history will show that Simpson is a premiership coach. I thought like many they’d fall from grace but sadly......Although they had a team in the right age demographic to challenge for a premiership. Is Simpson a better coach than Roly given the teams they’ve inherited and the list turnover in that time, well the jury is out. Though having won a premiership is hard to argue against. Beveridge is finding out about what a fall from grace can do to your credentials. Many people who are well credentialed in the AFL landscape still rates Roly highly. Those would also say that he’s very much under the blowtorch in 2019. Especially given our trade period. So now that the cobblers have done the cobbling, I’ve got little doubt that the head cobbler will deliver his 2020 vision.
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pollyanna Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #52

pollyanna
I have no insider knowledge of the Cockburn Control centre yet I understand their responsibility structure. However, I watch the football very closely. Here's my division of ultimate responsibility for the crap I've watched for the past three seasons:

Players: 5%
Weather: 2%
RoLy: 93%.
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The_Yeti, DazzElle, Raglan Matt, themagoos said You Beaut

hypen Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #53

hypen
I'm 43% sure Morgan is correct.
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The_Yeti, DocDocker said You Beaut

Corporal Agarn Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #54

Corporal Agarn
I'm 57% unsure if Morgen is correct.
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The_Yeti said You Beaut

Jezza Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #55

Jezza
Morgan is 100% correct. I’m 100% convinced of that.
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Corporal Agarn Lyon Tells Ryan 5 years 5 months ago #56

Corporal Agarn
"My speculative view as a fan is that our assistant coaches are below league average and have been for a while, that we’ve had some issues with our injury management, we missed on a run of late first-round picks, and that Lyon’s tendency towards defence hurts our scoring."

I'm 99.99% sure that Jezza didn't read all of Morgan's comments, because this part is critical of Roly and and the club and that is a big no no in Jezzaworld.
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The_Yeti said You Beaut