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Forward Hope

TOPIC: Forward Hope

Bizkit Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #1

Bizkit
Michael Apeness is someone I've liked the look of since his draft days. He is set to make his long awaited return this week and I thought the articles talking about him were pretty indicative of RL's twisting words that suit whatever narrative makes him look best.

In this article RL says, "The reality is he's 200cm, and his size and shape and mobility, he's really a ruckman that might be able to push forward. He was really never going to be a key forward, we wouldn't have thought, and I think he likes the ruck and sees that as his best position, so that's where we're grooming him."

In isolation that works for what the club has designed him for the past month or two at Peel but is in stark contrast to all the talk in his draft year and the resulting 4 or so years after. He was sold as the next great forward hope to support Pav and take over his mantle but now he was never recruited as a forward? Why did we always play him forward at Peel and again in his few games at AFL level?

If only RL was so flexible with his tactics on field as he is with his words and messages off it. There's so much BS out of the blokes running the club I can't help but look at everything they do as a sly attempt to rort someone and make themselves look good.

I hope Apeness isn't hung out to dry and is able to perform and show what he can do without injury in the next few weeks. Pure ruckwork is not what he was drafted for and shouldn't be how he's judged. He has a huge job this weekend and if he can fly for a few marks and push forward a little, he'll be doing well.
Nathan: When did you get balls?
Simon: I've always had balls you've just never seen them.
Nathan: That's the gayest thing I've ever heard.
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ICONDOCKER, Down on down, Burton said You Beaut

Morgan Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #2

Morgan
When he was drafted and until recently he's never really had a crack at being even a second-string ruckman for Freo. We had Sandi, Griff and Hendrix ahead of him in the ruck, and Hodor jumped head of him last year. However, we've been crying out for a big bloke who can at least make a contest in the forward 50m for years. I can see why they played him more forward than in the ruck.

With Sandi coming to the end of his career there is a chance to carve out a spot as a back-up ruckman and forward.

I've always liked how hard he attacks the contest. My guess is our forward line would look a lot better with him in it, even if he doesn't kick the goals himself.
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KingKepler said You Beaut

The_Yeti Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #3

The_Yeti
Those are almost the exact words Roly used about Kersten. 'sees himself as a defender', 'likes being a defender' etc

Except Kersten isn't a defenders big toe or even a fist. Kersten is a forward, in a similar vein to McCarthy.

Its indicative of my criticisms of Roly as a coach. He doesn't make use of what he has. He doesn't structure up to allow the players to do what they are good at but instead he tries to make them do what he's good at....and people wonder why that doesn't work.

Apeness is just going to have to ruck this weekend, theres no real alternative because we don't have Tabs, who is another tall forward we are trying to turn into a ruckman.

Before we make an offer for Hogan, maybe we should see how good he is a ruckman?
Egurls Suck!
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Dr Sleep said You Beaut

Morgan Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #4

Morgan
Geelong put a few years of development into Kersten as a forward, and at the end of that put his value in the trade to Freo as a fourth round pick. I think there is too much overlap between CamMac and Kersten at the selection table, and I think CamMac has more talent, and the greater chance to be a regular in a very good team. If Lyon shares a similar view - which based on selection you would suggest he does - his options are to keep Kersten plugging away at Peel as a back-up, or give him the chance to add another string to his bow and see how he goes as a defender.

I don't really see anything wrong with that approach. What's he going to learn about forward play in a season at Peel that he wouldn't have learned in a few years at Geelong?
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rogerrocks Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #5

rogerrocks
Ruckmen eh? I hear Caleb Daniel may want out of the Dogs...
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shirtfront said You Beaut

The_Yeti Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #6

The_Yeti
Morgan,

I agree that McCarthy has more talent but Kersten is still a very similar player. They are both mobile forwards but neither are a Tall marking forward of the ilk of Buddy or Hogan. They are both suited to running off a tall forward as they are both good overhead, mobile and reasonably good kicks.

Yes he's behind McCarthy but with McCarthy's current form, he's not that far behind. As for being a defender, well he's not very good at it and either way he's about 5 blokes away from getting a run at it. His last last against the Mighty Sharks was a bit of a dour day with the ball in congestion for most of the game and he still managed only one tackle, plenty of kicks but only 1 tackle.

He's a better forward. As for adding a string to his bow, he can either be a depth forward or a depth defender....and the list of forwards is much, much shorter.

Whats with Freo trying to turn every forward onto something other than a forward? Just because it worked for Tarrant doesn't mean its a panacea for all forwards.
Egurls Suck!
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut

Raglan Matt Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #7

Raglan Matt
Bizkit, Lyon says the same thing about Fyfe, that he doesn't want to play in the forward line. The more we hear about this
sort of thing, the more inclined I am to think Lyon is writing his own script with no regard to the actual facts of the matter at hand. Is he just being mischievous or is he genuinely deluded? Either way we would be better off without him, at any cost.
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pollyanna, Burton said You Beaut

Noddy Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #8

Noddy
Yeti,
Have you seen any other games with Kersten playing in the backline? One game one tackle is hardly a good sample and there's more to playing in the backline than tackling. How is he at fisting/spoiling?
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shane, rogerrocks said You Beaut

The_Yeti Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #9

The_Yeti
Yeah Noddy, I can't say I can remember him fisting the ball but to be fair, he's hardly any kind of a Zac.

The thing is, he's a forward. Yes we have one like him and yes he's not the best one of those that we have but there will come a time when we will need him as a forward. McCarthy isn't in great form right now and sometimes swapping them over might be required.

If he becomes our no 5 depth defender, what do we do if McCarthy gets injured / suspended.

Most on here agree we need more / better forwards but they don't grow on trees. It seems odd we get the ones we do have and try and turn them into things we don't really need.
Egurls Suck!
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purplepower, Corporal Agarn said You Beaut

Raglan Matt Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #10

Raglan Matt
Do you sense a recurring pattern here Yeti??
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The_Yeti Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #11

The_Yeti
RM,

Lyon wants to have 18 defenders on the field?

Jokes aside, its not something that can be sheeted onto just Lyon. I think that its an issue that extends right across the coaches and management. The first question I'd be asking is what Bond, Chris Bond is doing about this.

Are we drafting the right people? If so, why are we trying to turn them into something else?

A one off like Tarrant was a result of a a peculiar set of circumstances and very unusually, it worked and worked well. I think you'll find that most attempts to 'remake' a player will not end well and its a bit unfair on the player concerned.

Player X spends years as a forward and then fails as a defender, so gets dumped from his career. It happened with Barlow for example, we tried to turn an excellent inside mid into a half forward flanker and gave him the flick when that attempt failed. Fortunately, he succeeded elsewhere as an inside mid.

Go figure
Egurls Suck!
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Corporal Agarn said You Beaut

Suker Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #12

Suker
Lyon first suggested Kersten as a long term replacement for MJ. Now mj's role has mostly been the spare down back and I don't recall mj being much of a tackler, more of a receiver and distributor. So, Kersten, it would appear, is indeed being groomed for that role. The disturbing thing for me is that this is a continuation of the same plan involving a spare man back...all the time!
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut

Docker 26 Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #13

Docker 26
I'm confused, I came here looking for hope.
Where's the hope?
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purple mao said You Beaut

The_Yeti Forward Hope 5 years 10 months ago #14

The_Yeti
Suker,

Personally I think that Duman will take over MJ's role as the swingman across the half back line but it doesn't necessarily mean an extra man behind the ball.

We have Pearce A and Hamling taking the two best forwards, Wilson and Hill S on the flanks as our outlet players and also defending small forwards. MJ plays as a swingman and not taking a specific forward to defend. Duman can do that and do it well.

I don't see Kersten performing that role better than Duman. Not sure what others think.
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut
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