Herkes tarafından bilinerek sevilen site olan 1xbet canlı adresi sizlere büyük avantajlar ile farklı bahis imkanları sunmaktadır. Bilindik bir firma olması nedeni ile her defasında yeni bir 1xbet güncel adrese taşınıyor. Paylaşılan adreslerden sizlere en uygun 1xbet türkiye giriş güncel adresine kolaylıkla hemen ulaşabilirsiniz. Sizlerde kolaylıkla her cihazınızda aktif olan 1xbet mobile ile bahis yaparak, üyelik oluşumunu halledebilirsiniz. Büyük promosyonlardan yararlanarak üyelik açmak için 1xbet live adresini kullana bilirsiniz. Üyelik oluşturduktan sonra kolaylıkla yatırım yapmak için mobil ödeme bahis kabul gördüğünü anlayabilirsiniz. Hiç bir yerde olmayan canlı bahis özelliklerini sizlerde hemen kullanın. Aktif bir şekilde işlem yapan canlı bahis sitesi editörler tarafından özenle araştırılarak seçilmiştir. Ülkemizde resmi yayın yapmayan sitelerin çoğu kaçak bahis adı altında görev yapmaktadır. İnternetten yayın yapan kaçak bahis siteleri kullanıcılarına yüksek oranlar sunan bir adrestir. Hemen sizlerde casino oyunun farkına ve eğlencesine varmak için kayıt oluşturun.

TOPIC: Only one solution....

Rat Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #43

Rat
I remember a game when Silvagni jumped on top of J. Brown ,took a screamer and Brown ( I think ) didn't get a goal that game .
Another when he had half the Tigers team a bit scared to go near the ball he was running a muck in the rain .
Login to reply,

Morgan Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #44

Morgan
Yeti, my starting point with Lyon is that he likes being employed and he isn’t a complete idiot when it comes to football. We can park whether we think he’s a good coach for now, but he’s been coaching for a decade and has never been sacked, so it’s probably fair to say he knows at least a little about the game.

You seem to think Lyon’s game plan, dutifully executed by the players, is to bomb the ball long into the forward line. I see no evidence for that. If that were the case, Lyon and the match committee would probably select someone a bit a taller in the forward line to kick it to, or keep our best crumbing forwards at their feet. Neither of those things has happened.

If you take the last three games as a microcosm of the season, I thought against Geelong we played some really good football. We tried hard to move the ball quickly from defence, and used the corridor. We weren’t afraid to kick it long when there was space, and we tried to ‘get Geelong out the back’. For large patches it worked. The same was true for large patches of the game against North.

Against St Kilda’s very good (close to elite) pressure we were unable to do that. If you can’t win clean ball, and you don’t have players in space, then players have little choice but to kick it long to a contest. I don’t consider that part of the game plan, rather it’s the product of not being able to enforce our will and our desire to play a certain way against better opposition. As RR correctly states, there are two teams out there, and sometimes the opposition is better at closing down your options and dictating how the game is played. It’s what we used to do to other teams when we were good.

The third quarter against North was a case in point. We couldn’t get our hands on the ball, and when we did we didn’t have much space. At that point the only option left is to hoof it to a contest. I also think it’s strange that people think that for three quarters Lyon instructs Freo to play a certain way, and then instructs them to play very differently – and much worse - for a quarter. It just seems to strike me as nonsensical that Lyon, who seems pretty inflexible, says ‘hey guys, I know we’ve got a 3 goal lead playing this way, but how about for the next quarter you just start kicking it long to a forward line’, a forward line that anyone who understand football knows is likely to be consistently out-marked.

I think it’s far more likely the players are reacting to circumstances on the field. I personally think we need someone in the forward line who can at least present a target when the opposition forces us to kick it long to a contest, which is why I’d prefer to have Tabs in the team, but I don’t think ‘kicking it long’ is Plan A.

Further, our board has three very good former players and Bond was a Captain and B&F winner. They have a big say in deciding on Lyon’s coaching contracts. Your position seems to be predicated on basis that you can see that the idea that bombing the ball into a small forward line is a bad idea, but Lyon, the rest of the coaching department, the GM and the Board think it is a feasible way to win football games. I don’t doubt you know about footy Yeti, but I suspect that mob do too, and also know that is unlikely to lead to winning football.

Which is why it seems completely implausible that it’s actually our game plan.
Login to reply,
goodie, Jooter, OK chief, maynefan, Quiexo said You Beaut

maynefan Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #45

maynefan
Encapsulated exactly what I think Morgan but in a much more erudite way. And I liked the way Ross stuck up for Harley Be on Footy Classified last night. I hope a couple of the journos from the worst were watching!
Login to reply,

The_Yeti Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #46

The_Yeti
Morgan,

your reply is a pretty good indicator of some of the problems. I'll look at what you say and try to be somewhat less verbose.

1. Roly. Yes never been sacked but then neither has Buckley or Dimma.

2. You seem to think Lyon’s game plan, dutifully executed by the players, is to bomb the ball long into the forward line.

Thats rubbish. I've never claimed that and I'm putting that to your poor understanding rather than being just plain contrary. My point had always been the game plan has a a flaw forward of the midfield. We do NOT maintain a forward structure (generally) and that has led to a lack of leads from from players inside our forward 50. Those leads that are offered on the odd occasions we have players forward are use under pressure because defenders have been able to flood back with our forwards. The result is generally kick and hope. Thats the flaw. I've never said the game plan was to bomb it in.

3. The Geelong game and the Norths game were similar. In the first half we maintained more of a forward structure, which was commented on at the time but only until half time, then we went defensive from the start of the second half, put an extra man back and lost all momentum.

The Norths games was the clearest example. In the first half, we kept forwards, forward and got most of our goals from kicking to leading players. Guy Smiley also pointed out that we used the corridor more and he was correct, we did and we did that because we had players to kick to forward of the ball instead of having our forwards collapse onto our midfield which is what we normally do under Lyon.

At half time he reverted to normal and we tried to clog the game up. Norths didn't score much but we didn't score at all. It wasn't until the last few minutes of the game that we put blokes forward again and scored late to win.

4. Agree on Tabs. Having McCarthy and Kersten isn't working. McCarthy is too far out of tune with his year off and Kersten is inconsistent and perhaps lazy. He jogs when he should be running, doesn't present much and goes missing for most of the game. Tabs at least provides a target, backup ruck and can get the ball down to the smalls if he doesn't mark.

5. I watched the Western Bulldogs game on Saturday night. In the second quarter they totally dominated Adelaide and the ball was in and out of their forward 50 for about 80% of the second quarter. They got 2 goals later in the second for all those 50 entries. Why? They didn't look for targets. They were too slow getting the ball in, allowed Adelaide to flood back and Adelaide either got intercept marks or were able to spoil the ball nearly every time. Sound familiar? I thought it was us playing except the Bullies did it more often than we do.

6. Go and watch the first and third quarters again of the Norths game. Look at the difference in out forward structure and the difference in the game.

7. Your point about our mids not getting the ball in the third is a*** about. We didn't lose momentum because our mids stopped getting the ball, our mid stopped getting the ball because we went defensive and clogged the midfield.

8. Roly says that "failure is feedback". I say he he's not listening to that feedback. He has a defensive mindset and is not paying enough attention to the offensive aspects. Maintaining a forward structure, 'expecting' our mids to win the ball on their own and then having players forward of the ball works better.

edit: Missed out on the less verbose but there you go
Egurls Suck!
Login to reply,
Rhufus said You Beaut

RideoftheVagaries Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #47

RideoftheVagaries
We have had periods under Lyon's time where we have used the corridor as much as possible. It can be hard to do for too long though because teams will try hard to stop you doing that. It then comes down to whether your personnel is better than the other teams and when you have a bunch of kids playing it's hard to purely outmatch your opponents on talent/momentum for a whole game (a big factor is also the momentum game which is a huge part this year and last).

The youth factor is also pivotal in maintaining structure. The longer the game and/or season wears on, the more the kids will wither in trying to maintain a structure. Sure you could just let them play on instinct, which is probably a viable option for GWS, but I'd say you wouldn't be likely to win any more games now and probably make a rod for yourself in trying to get them to play in a structured way when they're more developed.

Back on the point RR raised on the opposition's defence disrupting your forward structures, it makes no sense to decry their missing targets in the forward 50 and also decry sideways and backwards possessions further up the ground. It's not always possible for fast movement from the backline or middle (although we have seen some great examples of the team doing that this year), so sometimes you need to draw out the flooding defence and allow the smart forwards to eke themselves some space/opportunities.

We could also really do with a pack-bursting-contested-marking beast to add some options down there too.
;p
Login to reply,

Corporal Agarn Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #48

Corporal Agarn
Didn't see it but always pleased to hear about Roly going public in support of his players.
Login to reply,

walba Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #49

walba
While the Yeti/Morgan debate is as interesting as it is verbose, I hope you blokes are doing it on your own time.

The reality is that football has become like soccer and hockey. With most if not all players thrown back to defend, teams look most dangerous and are most vunerable on the counter attack. The slower the ball comes out of defence the more likely the defending team will intercept. Without obvious marking targets the Dockers are more vunerable to slow movement than others. But I don't see that Lyon is much different to other coaches in this regard. They need to bring in Taberner or Griffin to at least make a contest for the high ball. Kersten is a waste of a place in the team.

Edit Yeti: neither/nor either/or
Login to reply,

cletus Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #50

cletus
Just a thought, ...and would be interested in opinions.....

I've always seen Kersten as potentially a handy 'swingman'. Not in the REALLY useful swingman mould ( ie as examples Mcgovern, Mcintosh, Croad, Tazza, Taylor - ... NB some pretty poor examples there, I admit...), but 'handy'.

Is it time to 'Do a Tazza', and try and make him into a backman?? Its not really working for him up forward, even though he's at least a straight kick. With Johnno's future a bit sketchy, could he play as a tallish back and hold a spot there..???
Login to reply,

The_Yeti Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #51

The_Yeti
Walba,

Yes on my own time. Boss sent me home as they don't want to pay nearly 60 hours overtime, but there ya go.

Agree on Tabs...or Apeness when fit or another true tall but have him stay forward rather than try to get back before the defenders.

Also agree on Kersten. He is only visible for short periods, doesn't present much, jogs when he should be running...seems to have no tank or a bit lazy. No sure what the go is with him.

Don't get the last bit
Egurls Suck!
Login to reply,
Lazza040 said You Beaut

The_Yeti Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #52

The_Yeti
Cletus,

maybe but I'm not seeing it. He doesn't seem to have the right qualities. Not really creative and goes missing too much.

Maybe acting as defender might change that but I'm not seeing him in that roie
Egurls Suck!
Login to reply,
cletus said You Beaut

cletus Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #53

cletus
But if anyone is going to teach him to be a defensive player, Yeti, its Roly. Not sure too many thought a lead up forward like Tazza could do a job down back until Harvs put him there.

Added to that, he only has play at the standard of "The Fist" to have a lifetime role down there.

T. Fist wasn't too creative... There's only 6cm of height, 3 kg of weight, and the ability to kick, that seperates them...
Login to reply,

The_Yeti Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #54

The_Yeti
Hard to argue with the Roly bit (hehe) but if you are using the spack as your yardstick, you're starting mighty low...and I'm talking Anthony / Sylvia territory.

Thats not going to cut it when you've got Hamling and Pearce A (when fit). I dont see him as a speedy HBF type, he's not creative enough to be a Johnno type and doesn't work hard enough in my view.

Frankly don't want another fist down there. (don't Google that btw) He just wasn't AFL quality and under the current rules / interpretations, we can't carry such a limited player.
Egurls Suck!
Login to reply,
rogerrocks said You Beaut

Noddy Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #55

Noddy
I'm impressed with how our young guys have come on this year and I generally go to games now thinking if we play our best we can take it up to most, which is pretty damn good given the age and lack experience of some of our guys. I reckon the coach has played a huge part in all of this.
Login to reply,
OK chief, Docker by the Sea said You Beaut

Docker by the Sea Only one solution.... 6 years 9 months ago #56

Docker by the Sea
Tell ya who is a crab, Beveridge never even prepared a top four team. Hardwick on the other hand he can coach have you seen some of the footy Richmond have played this year. Pyke is a genius his team has played at least 18 games of very good footy.
Hard to fathom the criticism of Lyon after his record now looks like he may even be able to rebuild a team. Not to say he will achieve the ultimate with us, AFL premierships are hard to win and even harder to win now, especially from this side of the country. I think with the new bye before finals it may have got even harder from here.
Login to reply,
OK chief said You Beaut