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TOPIC: So...

blockerhall So... 6 years 10 months ago #1

blockerhall
List the teams below that you think we are better than, both now and through to 2019.
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Blue1red1 So... 6 years 10 months ago #2

Blue1red1
East Fremantle?

OK I'll show myself out......
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R.Lyon said You Beaut

shane So... 6 years 10 months ago #3

shane
That kind of thinking is where I have a problem. It stems from the idea of creating a premiership window. This idea that if you follow the plan the bosses drew up on a whiteboard and stick to the process then you will become worthy of being in contention. If not, you start again with a new plan. The idea that you will eventually deserve to win a premiership.

It's why clubs like Carlton have rolling 5 year plans and never seem to get anywhere.

So while I don't think we are the best team in the competition, there is no team in the competition this year that we could not beat in the right set of realistic circumstances.
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut

mac So... 6 years 10 months ago #4

mac
Personally I don't give a toss about making finals every year. The media start asking coaches and players before the start of the season will you make the finals? Then the stats crap of age etc.
Give me a team gives 100% plus though out every season.
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hypen So... 6 years 10 months ago #5

hypen
The point is that Carlton, Brisbane, Saints, Melbourne, Essendon even Gold Coast are all about to hit their straps and I can see the good sides staying good for a while.

I had this thought the other day so I will attempt to answer the original question, given how we are going at this very point in time, probably Hawthorn and Nth.

I reckon there is a bit of 2015 in our season where we had a jump on opponents with our fitness and then hit a bit of a wall. I think its catching up with us now.

Premiership windows may be a crock Shane, I think it can turn quickly but its undeniable you need a few years to get back up again if you have lost significant experience. As we have.

The rest of the season will be tough. So what, I enjoy watching the young fellas - think they play a great style. I am sure we are going to be a very good football in pretty quick time (few years).
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goodie, okeedokee said You Beaut

blockerhall So... 6 years 10 months ago #6

blockerhall
I think it is fair to temper where we are at. I look at all the other sides and they are much closer to a premiership than we are. North was the only one I could think of, I wasn't confident about the hawks, and Brisbane's upside far exceeds ours. I think structurally we are in dangerous territory now.
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goodie said You Beaut

hypen So... 6 years 10 months ago #7

hypen
We need a quality CHF and CHB.

Mundy will need to be replaced at some point and we need another decent ball user in the back half. Hopefully that is Ryan.

We'll get an early pick and we need to find a way of getting into this draft in the 2nd rd, we traded that pick away. This upcoming draft is a good one, clubs won't be trading for picks in future drafts. Too much talent in this one.
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cletus So... 6 years 10 months ago #8

cletus
I think Blockerhall and hypen have made great and very valid points.
The bigger question, however, is who thinks we are in a better position than the aforementioned teams ??(Car, StK, Brissy, Ess, Melb, Suns & and may I include GWS).???
Part of me wants to include Sydney 2017 in this as well....but ....!!
Common denominator through a these teams, is that they have attempted -successfully or not - to rebuild with kids, and, yes have had to suffer some extreme pain doing it.
Have a look at the "basket case" Brisbane. Have a look at the kids they have in their back half and be very jealous. Just have a look at some of the guns that are flinging around StKilda, ..and Carlton. Yes, GWS and GC have been assisted to get to the position they are in, but surely the "Build via youth " model is now showing its dividends.
Yep, all of the above teams got plently wrong along the way.
But, - I dunno - I reckon memberships and supporters are patient with rebuilds via youth.
And not for just this reason, we simply have to get all the young ones playing ASAP, and do a proper rebuild, starting this week.
Carlton, Brissy, Suns and Saints are are lot closer to sustained success than Kangas, Collingwood, Hawks and The Slime, and I think Sydney have been really clever with the path they took for the first part of 2017.
Then consider where Freo is at...???
We simply have to start playing all the young blokes...ready or not...!
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shane So... 6 years 10 months ago #9

shane
I'm not suggesting you can always have a team good enough to win a premiership.

Firstly, this year's premiership team will not be making the list of all time greats. This is an in between year. Like 2006 when a bit of luck in the finals fixture could have seen us in the grand final. No one has to beat Hawthorn in their finest hour to win the flag.

Secondly, we didn't cut the team to the ground and start again. We trimmed some dead wood and recruiting starting 18 senior players. We're not a young team and our best players are in their prime. The young blokes aren't even that young, I'm not sure what it is that they're not able to do.

We should be in amongst it, not hiding behind a rebuild and hoping for a draft pick that will bring us a saviour. We have a saviour. He's got long hair and has some crazy idea and his name is Nathan.
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DazzElle, Raglan Matt said You Beaut

hypen So... 6 years 10 months ago #10

hypen
Understood. You believe in premiership windows of opportunity.
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Raglan Matt So... 6 years 10 months ago #11

Raglan Matt
I believe in "Get out there and play the game, and things will happen"
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freo00 said You Beaut

Jezza So... 6 years 10 months ago #12

Jezza
We've had a significant number of players who haven't played much football in 12 months. Our wins this year suggests that when our senior players are firing we're in games longer. That tapered 3-4 weeks before the bye. I think we'll win a few more games especially after the bye and who knows if we're 10wins after round 18 or 19, we could play finals. That's a good outcome in year 1 of the rebuild.
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FDB So... 6 years 10 months ago #13

FDB
No, a good outcome from a rebuild is a team rebuilt - not one still relying on the same cadre of players in/near their 30s to achieve a mid-ladder finish.
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cletus said You Beaut

Flag_2005 So... 6 years 10 months ago #14

Flag_2005
I'm not convinced on the Saints and the Gold Coast without Ablett (and Barlow) next year will be interesting to watch.

You only have to look at Carlton (historically) to see how unpredictable the whole thing is. They have had more no.1 picks running around than any club and, bar GWS in more recent times, probably more top 10 picks. If you talk premiership windows based on top end talent, theirs was wide open and got slammed shut. Even now they are being talked up but Gibbs, Murphy, Simpson and Kruezer who are all in their best 6 or 7 will not be around for a flag.

There's a whole lot of intangible stuff that goes with draft picks, coaching etc... to determine where you finish. Look at the Bulldogs last year.

On our day we can beat anyone but to win the GF from position 5 - 8 you need to have 4 of those days in a row and we aren't capable of that.
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut