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Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent

TOPIC: Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent

Ricco Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #1

Ricco
So on this previous post, I made a comment that I think we have a coaching and development problem and not a player talent problem - www.dockerland.com/index.php?option=com_...Itemid=251&id=490662

There has been a lot of discussion about us not having early draft picks, not having the "A-grade" talent at our disposal and suffering as a result of a lot of B-Grade players. I was interested to look where players actually got drafted and what effect it had on ladder position.

I went back and did some analysis on 3 random teams and the results are below (*). Naturally, the lower the number indicates more players taken earlier in the draft - i.e. a score of "22" means the team had 22 number 1 picks:
Adelaide - the current ladder leaders:
Total score - 1398
Average draft position - 63
Number of selections within the top 20 - 5
Number of former rookie list players - 8

Western Bulldogs Premiership Team
Total score - 1136
Average draft position - 51.6
Number of selections within the top 20 - 4
Number of former rookie list players - 5

Fremantle Dockers team that lost to Brisbane
Total score - 1012
Average draft position - 46
Number of selections within the top 20 - 7
Number of former rookie list players - 4

I.e. we had on average a team of players that were selected higher up in the draft than the WB premiership team and current ladder leaders. So we are either not picking the right players, not coaching them well or not developing them (my guess is the second / third)

* - disclaimers - it is possible I've messed up data. I have assigned a draft number of 100 to rookie list selections in the absence of that data.
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goodie, Morgan, purplepower, freo00 said You Beaut

Drubbing Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #2

Drubbing
The largest variable is the chocolate wheel of the draft. Some year's the no1 pick is a dud or simply an above average player in a thin draft, others the top 5 is crammed with talent.

GCS and GWS have pillaged the drafts in recent years and still are. You got to coach what you get. I don't see a great deal of coaching going on, considering we've a fleet of them.

I'll say one thing about coaching. I started masters hockey this year. I knew little about the game and strategy. In just two months, I can get a handle on it, as it's kept real simple. I mark blokes up when defending, and pull them out of position and make space when attacking. My skills need work, but I can run fat old blokes off their feet and I'm a reliable pass. Most of us are new at the game, but we're a competitive team in a comp with blokes been together in teams for 10-20 years. Shane Parker got invited to join us, but there was only a FB possie and he'd have to take the hit ins...

If I can do it without much experience or a Phd in hockey rocket surgery, so should blokes who have done little else their whole lives and do it full time.
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rogerrocks, Raglan Matt said You Beaut

purplepower Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #3

purplepower
I agree with u....I don't see a great deal of coaching going on
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freo00 said You Beaut

larkin Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #4

larkin
Have you done a review of who lined up in the centre at bounce downs (and for how long) in our last games?
Who played where and on who?
How many times a newbie got caught out of position and left a gaping hole in our defence?
No? Pity. Rolys game plan is a tightly structured defence with offensive options - but which can easily unravel with poor defensive positioning.
My guess is Roly and Co are playing the long game and sizing up players for the longer term. Pushing them to see who has what it takes. And he will have learnt a lot about which players can't cut the mustard.
Meanwhile we have played more players than any other team this year. Some will go, some need game time to be further assessed. Some just dont have what it takes but they have been given a chance. And thats about it – other than knowing 6 day breaks are a killer.
Todays game is built from the half back line and thats where we need more strength. Going 2 talls forward 3 back might still be the answer if you have the talent – but we don't yet have even that.
211, Mundy Johnson are all top shelf but their days are limited. What you can expect for the rest of the year is a search for options for them and a few others.
A point will come when a decision is made on whether it is more useful to make the finals – for the fun of it – or to the future with game time into newbies and drafty picks.
And thats what he should do.
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thegeniusthatis said You Beaut

thegeniusthatis Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #5

thegeniusthatis
And both options possess positives: the former in that the players will have to show intention and resolve, meaning that some of the newbies have elevated their game; the latter might see us add another early draft pick - Liam Ryan maybe.
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larkin Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #6

larkin
or maybe not. Nyhuis has done a good job on him twice.
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ICONDOCKER Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #7

ICONDOCKER
It's a long long game for the coaches to make up their minds on Sheridan and Sutcliffe
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Raglan Matt, Corporal Agarn said You Beaut

Noddy Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #8

Noddy
Haselby is of the view the game plan was ok from Rd 3-9 and in the last three for a number of reasons we haven't been able to execute the plan. 211 missing is one reason.

To the coach bashers...... Ever seen a team get belted in the middle and lose contested and uncontested stats and win a game? Mundy, Fyfe, Neale, Blakely and a few others are knackered from running their guts out to drag us over the line in a few games.

I doubt whether there's been a season when so many top eight sides have been beaten by bottom eight sides.
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cletus, Bevdon said You Beaut

goodie Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #9

goodie
Good job ricco. The issue has always been talent identification- we are not very good at it, in particular key position players.
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Jezza Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #10

Jezza
Coaching any sport starts at the grassroots level. When you play elite sport, it becomes a refining stage. The 18 AFL coaches are player managers. They are the conductors in an orchestra. Roly, in his pressers talks about preparing the team for a GF every week until the last dance. There are 16 players who are walkup starts in our 22. That includes HB and Ballas. Currently the search is on for the bottom 6 of the 22. The wins and losses at this stage is secondary. We've improved since last year. Teams like Syd, Hawks, NM and even the Bulldogs wouldn't be thrilled at where their teams are at. I see plenty of upside in Freo.
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shane Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #11

shane
Everyone sees plenty of upside to Fremantle. That's the problem. They're under performing.
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FDB Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #12

FDB
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FDB Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #13

FDB
Nothing but upside.
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Corporal Agarn Poor Coaching vs Lack of Talent 6 years 10 months ago #14

Corporal Agarn
So if we're underperforming and there is so much upside then it would have to come down to the coaching staff and/or the game plan. Wouldn't it?
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