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TOPIC: Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12

TeamDocker Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #1

TeamDocker
Most Freo supporters think Roly is the Messiah! As a diehard supporter this sort of thinking annoys me! Freo can and will not progress as a team with him at the realm!

He's a great coach with a great W/L record they said!
It is correct that he came to Freo with a W/L percentage of 64.5%. However, people fail to recognise he inherited a A-grade team in their premiership window (After Grant Thomas was unfairly sacked for finishing 6th in 2006 - I'd pay millions just to finish 6th this year). Blind Freddie could have taken a team including Robert Harvey, Brendon Goddard, Steven Milne, Leigh Montagna, Nick Riewoldt, Fraser Gehrig, Lenny Hayes, Nick Dal Santo, Luke Ball and Kozzie, to a premiership. Not to mention solid second string players like the Clarke Brothers, Matt McGuire, Fisher, Gram and Gilbert. Did Ross take them to a premiership??

It's easy to have a good W/L record when you inherit an A-grade team and then you leave when you see the "re-build" coming!

He's the best coach we've ever had they said!
Mark Harvey was sacked in 2011. A year in which we stayed in the top eight until round 20. Yes, we lost the last 7 games of the year, but our injury run that year was as bad as the one we are currently experiencing. Harv's bought back player early from injury just to try an secure a finals birth (Stupid I Know). In the last round of 2011 the following players were unavailable: Matthew Pavlich, David Mundy, Nat Fyfe, Luke McPharlin, Hayden Ballantyne, Adam McPhee, Nick Lower and Matthew de Boer. Not one person allowed Harv's a concession for having an understrengthed team that year, why then do we afford Roly that luxury.

The team Roly inherited included: Pav, Hill, Fyfey, Jono, Sandi, Barlow, Mundy, Ballas, Crowley, Morabito, Son Son, Ibbo & heaps of other serviceable players. I had so much hope going into 2012, these players were always going to be guns.... then we hired Ross :(

Ross took this team to one GF. Wow! Adam Simpson took a similarly skilled unit to a GF in his second year! As did John Longmire! Not good enough! My 3 year old cousin could have coached the squad Freo had between 2012 - 2015 to at least 3 GF's.

Defence wins premierships they said!
I know some Freo players and they don't have any believe in Ross Lyon's game plan, and they definitely didn't have any faith in the previous defensive one. I remember having dinner with a player the week of last years Prelim and he told me that he was unconfident about their chances. He didn't end up playing, but he said the whole Freo camp was feeling unconfident. Great just what a supporter wants to hear.

In no sport is defence a good strategy! Defence can hold up of a while, but it will always be beaten by attack. Offensive pressure is the best type of defence in any sport. Jack Gunston once told a good friend that Hawthorne knew they would win the 2013 GF before they had even arrived at the ground. They knew they could kick more goals than Freo.

I hope the board sees through Ross' charade and he is not our coach in 2017. After shifting blame onto his assistance. He will probably jump ship to another team despite still being contracted to Freo. Wouldn't be the first time......

This year reminds me of 2011, St Kilda 2011

#AnyonebutRoss
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purplethai, teasea said You Beaut

Bizkit Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #2

Bizkit
While there's nothing I can say for your personal conversations and how true or false they may be, most of your points are solid and pretty much exactly what a lot of us were saying for years after stabbing Harvs in the back.

Having said that I don't know if changing coach at this point is a good idea. Unlike the present admin who's treatment of Harvs was dispicable, I'm willing to give RL a chance at doing two things he's never had to do, rebuild a side and a decent hopefully attacking game plan. RL has had it very, very easy for a very long time and everyone raved about his record and coaching genius. Now for the first time he's facing a massive challenge and he is going to have to learn to adapt very quickly and change the way he goes about coaching.

Morgan mentioned it earlier today and I agree I don't think he knows how to really develop a team. It's not a strength of his but with a 5 year contract extension he's now locked into giving it a shot. If we're lucky it's a quick season down the bottom getting games into some kids before a big effort in the off season to grab a couple of talented youngsters at the draft and a lucky trade or two like McCarthy. Get all our stars back on the park and maybe we'll have a shot at a premiership next year with a better and more balanced game plan.

If not then I don't really want to think about the consequences for anyone at the club whether it's management, the players or the fans. It could get ugly for us.
Nathan: When did you get balls?
Simon: I've always had balls you've just never seen them.
Nathan: That's the gayest thing I've ever heard.
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teasea said You Beaut

Raglan Matt Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #3

Raglan Matt
Your 3 yo cousin is wasting his time at play group then.
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Blue1red1, The_Yeti, point less, DJKL said You Beaut

Davo Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #4

Davo
You can't blame the coach for the team kicking 8.13 in the 2013 GF any more than kicking 8.16 in R6 2016. Your comments are way OTT.

If you hadn't noticed, the MCG is Hawthorn's home ground which makes them virtually unbeatable there. It is also the reason why Freo, West Coast and the Western Bulldogs will never beat them there.
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Jezza Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #5

Jezza
I thought on paper, we still had a pretty good side against Adelaide on the weekend. In fact, kicking 16 behinds from 24 scoring shots would do any side in let alone Freo. Like I said, we're down on a few stars atm, this group will turn the corner. Though, I rather see us get a top 3 draft pick instead.
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DocDocker said You Beaut

Drubbing Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #6

Drubbing
When you're cutting and pasting from Mark Duffield, you can't be wrong can you?
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The Spud Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #7

The Spud
Gunston must have been pooping his pants in the 3rd quarter of the 2013 GF (given how he "knew" they were going to win) when we were all over them. But for a bit of inexperience we could/should have won it. That was probably on of our worst games of the year and to lose to the greatest team of this generation, if not ever, by 15 points was a greater display of coaching than of great players. Not to mention getting there in the first place.
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TeamDocker Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #8

TeamDocker
It seems hypocritical for the board to ruthlessly sack Harv's, yet for them to fully support Ross and Bondy when they are also not achieving the required KPI's.

The successful Eastern States teams don't just sit back and accept poor performances (i.e.. Matty Knights, Dean Laidley, Ratten, Malthouse, Primus, McKenna and McCartney). And we must not accept poor performances, it breeds a culture of complacency (i.e. Free 2001). Losing two players should not result in the fall of grace we have experienced. To me it indicates there is a lot of disharmony at the club.

For a rebuild you want someone who can inspire players and build talent. Roll has not developed the talent in Mayne, Suban, Mzungu, Mellington etc. If anything the talent/skills of our squad has gone backwards under Roly. These young players need to be able to play instinctual fast running football, not just robots that conform to an archaic structure.

On these message boards many people have championed "The coach can't execute skills", this is rubbish. My employer is always ups killing me. Why to adults go to tennis coaches (my part-time profession).... to improve their technical skills. Mason Cox at Collingwood is showing that you can teach skills to players in their 20's, contrary to popular belief. In American sports, soccer and tennis the professional athletes are constantly practicing and imp[roving their skills. IT IS ROLY'S JOB TO ENSURE THE PLAYERS HAVE THE SKILLS. NO QUESTIONS ASKED!!!
I know I would not listen or be inspired by to someone who nearly declared bankruptcy, walked out on their old employer and stabbed a colleague in the back, real moral convictions ....


Bring in a fresh face and let a new coach oversee the rebuild. Otherwise we might get Ross 2.0, where a coach inherits a good team without putting in the hard yards! It's a curve ball but someone like Tom Harley might not be bad. Good leader at the Cats, AIS Coach (so one would assume he has a good eye for talent) and now GM at Sydney (making him good at understanding the behind the scenes stuff).

However, extending Roly's contract til 2020 has meant we are stuck with him or alternatively we will incur a massive financial burden to pay out his contract.

Side Note: Ben Brown was taken a lot later than Apness in the 2013 draft. Pick 17 vs Pick 47. I know who I would rather have. Who said KPP don't come late in the draft.....
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TeamDocker Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #9

TeamDocker
Davo hate to break it to you, but the coach has the job of teaching his players the correct technique. You don't see NFL players miss too many punts and they only kick once or twice a match.

Why, you ask.
Because technical skills are drummed into them at training.

If the problem is confidence related (ie. Mayne) then the sports psych should fix.

People say Hawks are awesome. You don't have to tell me that, I know.
But why has Roly only beaten them once since 2012 when other teams have found ways to beat them like Rich, Port.
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RideoftheVagaries Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #10

RideoftheVagaries
Tom Harley. LOL.
;p
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Blue1red1 Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #11

Blue1red1
ROV, if that made you laugh, what about Stevie J then?
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moptop Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #12

moptop
Pfft! Stevie J...

There's only one man with the godlike bearing required to bring us everlasting glory. I give you...

Mr Matthew Pavlich.
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Flag_2005 Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #13

Flag_2005
I was in need of a laugh today and this thread has provided it.

Thank you.
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut

jimb2 Saint Kilda Circa 2011/12 7 years 11 months ago #14

jimb2
I think having a specialist player waiting on the bench who can come onto the ground when required for an important kick or two like they do in the NFL is a superb idea. It's a 110% goer. We just need to get the AFL to change the rules a little. Are you freakin joking?

And, yes, I'm 100% sure those guys a personally tutored by their head coach. I'd also like to see Ross wandering around with one of those Motorola headsets too. They're clunky cool.
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