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TOPIC: Hooker Stays

DockerKnockers Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #57

DockerKnockers
Pardon my ignorance Hypen, but if you or anybody else could list those players in the last 5 years that Freo have tried to recruit and failed to do so, it would help my understanding of the Bond blaming.
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shane Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #58

shane
Taberner's best 10 games versus Hookers only 10 games as a forward when we want him as a defender?

You don't work for BIS Shrapnel, do you?
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hypen Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #59

hypen
Okay I will, but before I start the discussion point is capability of getting players to come to Fremantle. That is the issue at hand. If you then tell me that they are no good and its worked out best we didn't get them, you are supporting my argument. That we can't even get crap over here;

I know we had a crack at the following talls:

Cloke, Buddy ,Shultz ,Taylor, Hooker, Black, Clarke and Dixon.
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DockerKnockers Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #60

DockerKnockers
Really Shane?
"Taberner's top 10 games in terms of TOG, 89-96%, to be fair given Tabs number of subbed games" ... that is not Taberner's 10 best games ... his stats would be better if it was his 10 best games.
Those stats include some games when Taberner was only 20years of age vs Hooker (26 yrs old).
And just to be clear, I'm not even a fan of Taberner, so in no way am I trying to say Tabs is as good, but Hooker is not worth an estimated 5 times as much as Taberner ... that I do know. I wouldn't have a problem with Freo paying Hooker $2million a year to get him, if Freo didn't have too worry about managing that thing called a salary cap.

Again, it's all in the details, details many of you prefer to ignore.
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shane Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #61

shane
The main detail you're ignoring is that we wanted him and we wanted to give him a lot of money to come. That detail flies in the face of your he's no good and he's getting paid too much money argument.
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DockerKnockers Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #62

DockerKnockers
Cheers Hypen.
They were names I was familiar with.

Many of those re-signed with their clubs. They may well have been using Freo to simply drive up their market value with no real desire to leave ... unless their clubs told them to bugger off.

If you can pick any one of them and present a case as to what Freo/Bondy should have offered to get them here then that would help. Without seeing and understanding the details, it looks like a witch hunt to me.
For example, you have listed Hooker, Freo reportedly offered in the range of $5million (across 5 years). What do you think we should have offered, given we have a total player payments salary cap of about $11million next year and over half of that will already be used up by our current top10 players.
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DockerKnockers Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #63

DockerKnockers
Shane, I think Hooker is one of the leagues great players (in the top100, close to top50). I highly value a good Contested Marker, which Hooker is. Nowhere have I stated that Hooker is not that good, except when discussing his value and payments in the region of $1million per year. That is almost 10% of Freo's 2017 salary cap.

I like statistics and numbers because I can quantify an argument. Once again here, it's the numbers, the offered salary, the Salary cap, his age, his stats, his peers, all details which lead me to my point of view ... rather than just a simple hatred of Bond.
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shane Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #64

shane
You ignored his All Australian selection, you ignored his best and fairest award, you used a defender's goal kicking stats to compare him to a forward and you're ignoring that we tried to get him at similar money which means that there was no issue with the salary cap.

You've come to a conclusion and found some dodgy numbers which you think support it. His peers? Come off it.

At best, you're argument is that Chris Bond targeted the wrong player and risked damaging the list by putting an average player on too much money.
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Mike Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #65

Mike
Cale Hooker is a very good player; it would have been good to have recruited him, but good on him for staying at Essendon.

My query is: where do we get the figures from? Surely not from Fremantle. Is it in Essendon's interests to divulge information about an offer from another club to an impending free agent? Certainly it is in the player's (and the player's manager's) interests. In fact, would it possibly be in the player's (manager's) interests to let slip some slightly exaggerated information?
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DockerKnockers said You Beaut

Bizkit Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #66

Bizkit
Except wages are determined by so many other factors outside of how good the player is in terms of the top however many players in the competition. Blokes who love the club and want to be at the club tend to be happy to take a pay cut or receive below market value for a number of reasons and when you are trying to poach someone from another club you have to pay over their value.

How much we were willing to pay Hooker is not an issue, if we can afford it we do it. The fact we have been good at retaining our players and on cheaper contracts because a lot of them like Fyfe, Hill and Walters would never go anywhere being West Aussies who love the club, means we are able to splash out on players we need to help the others who have taken cuts become more successful.

Hooker perfectly fit the bill for us as one of the top 5 KPD in the comp, in his prime and interested in coming home to Freo where he is from. Failing to get him is a very poor reflection on Bond.
Nathan: When did you get balls?
Simon: I've always had balls you've just never seen them.
Nathan: That's the gayest thing I've ever heard.
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DockerKnockers Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #67

DockerKnockers
Um, from what I understand, if Fyfe had have played a full season in 2016 he would have been one of the top5 paid players in the competition, about $1million for the year. I've also read only a few players in the competition were paid $1million last year (NB: this is salary cap payments ... they can earn extra from third party payments).

Hence why I think Hooker was not good value.
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DockerKnockers Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #68

DockerKnockers
I was glad Freo were targeting Hooker. It was the cost, if accurate, of $1million for 5 years that I didn't like.

Shane, what do you think Freo should have offered? $1.1m/yr or $2m/yr?
... because apart from you debating my reasons for my opinion that Hooker's not worth that amount, and you wanting to again blame Bondy, I have no idea what you think Freo should have done ... well no details anyway.
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KingKepler Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #69

KingKepler
The strategy to recruit proven KPPs using free agency has been a miserable failure and the club should abandon it and use the draft or trade to get the players we need.
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shane Hooker Stays 7 years 11 months ago #70

shane
My point is that we have a long running trend of not being able to get the players we want. In isolation you can make up whatever gobbledygook numbers you like (Seriously? His peers?) but eventually someone at the club has to stop making excuses and fix the problem.
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Lazza040 said You Beaut
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