TOPIC: Hodor Appreciation Post

Walter the baker Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #29

Walter the baker
Sadly Lobb looks like he has a tornado going on in his head when he is lining up for goal. It's the footy equivalent of Ian Baker-Finch's golfing yips.
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rogerrocks Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #30

rogerrocks
So Lobb is a bit like Chris Tarrant, eh? I wonder how he would feel about becoming a key defender.
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut

cletus Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #31

cletus
I didnt mean to 'You Beaut' that CA (although I respect your observation...)...i was trying to reply to Morgan's comment. ...but - whilst I'm at it - I reckon I don't mind Freddy missing at the moment...he's got upside. Tonnes of it!

I'm not sure I can see goal kicking upside with the other 2, but , I'm hopeful they'll turn it around. We are a potent attacking team if they do.

But Morgan, the reason you can construct the sentence " we are a poorer goal kicking team than we were under Ross Lyon " (or words to that effect) is only because we are having more shots at goal than what we were under Ross Lyon.

It is complete 'spin' to suggest Ross Lyon made us a better goal kicking team.

And the reason we are doing that, is we have a much better semblance of a game plan, than what we had under Ross Lyon. and there is recognition that forward structure is important, and, if you put a few down there, you'll have a much better pathway to goal.

That didn't exist under Lyon. Irrespective of what stats you retort with.

In fact, I'd go as far to say, we now have a game plan, where as under Ross Lyon, we clearly didn't. It was a complete fustercluck.!
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shane, CaptSnooze, jezzaargh, Raglan Matt said You Beaut

hypen Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #32

hypen
Can't we all just agree that Caleb Serong is nowhere near Ted Whitten at the same stage of his career. I'm not writing him off just yet though. Happy to be proven wrong.
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shane, rogerrocks said You Beaut

Morgan Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #33

Morgan
I don't really have a strong view on it Cletus. I just know that despite our improvement across the ground, we still aren't slotting goals. We're first in the league for behinds, but 13th for goals. Given we've won more than we've lost, and played in pretty good conditions, that's an interesting stat to me. The commentators can’t go five minutes without mentioning it, so it’s reasonably front of mind.

When we were good under Lyon (say, 2013) we kicked an average score of 13.10. When we were bad under Lyon (say, 2018) we kicked 10.9. We’re pretty good under JLo and we’re kicking 11.14. I didn’t say Ross Lyon made us a better goal kicking team. He didn’t. In fact he seemed pretty indifferent about the whole goal scoring thing. We just seem to be objectively worse at the act of kicking for goal this year.

It just looks to me that the good kicks at goal in the team are kicking goals, and the bad kicks at goal are kicking points. I've always thought that way, but for a long time mine was the minority view, and that our bad goal kicking was a function of the coach, either because of the lack of skills training, or the game plan. I’m just wondering whether now some of the other variables have been removed, people are more inclined to see it as a problem rooted in the players, or whether there is something I’m missing (like are we kicking from too far out, or more from the pockets).

It’s no biggie. It's probably just noise in the data because Fyfe left his kicking boots in his Dad's truck, and I reckon it will come around if Fyfe and Lobb tidy up their kicking a bit. I was just curious what people thought, and it turns out the answer is that Ross Lyon sucks.
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cletus, rogerrocks said You Beaut

TheColonel Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #34

TheColonel
You only have to back to Fyfes first game 1Goal 4 Points
From The AwFL
"..
Nat Fyfe

The signs were there immediately that Fyfe was a superstar in the making. The slightly built 18-year-old used his athleticism to thrill the Subiaco Oval crowd on debut in round five, 2010, taking three contested marks and turning one of those into his first AFL goal. He won seven of his 13 possessions in the contest, despite weighing in at just 76kg, and he hit teammates with passes that showed his football IQ was well advanced. The blemish on his game was a final return of 1.4, but it was easily forgiven in a 39-point win against Richmond. - Nathan Schmook

Other contenders: Sam Sturt (10 disposals, three goals, R1, 2020), Sean Darcy (14 disposals, 40 hit-outs, R14, 2017).."
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kidmaple Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #35

kidmaple
It's interesting to see Lobb identified as a bad kick at goal. While he's certainly have a lean patch at the moment, I seem to recall him being a pretty good kick a couple of years back - before the slight stutter turned into a sewing machine.

Perhaps he just needs a bit of time to make the new (old) routine more natural (again) and then we'll see an improvement. He always seems to middle the ball, unlike Fyfe, who kicks some real flourbags when kicking for goal (not his field kicking).
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CaptSnooze said You Beaut

Morgan Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #36

Morgan
I'm not sure if Lobb's ever been a good kick at goal, but these days he's just no chance if he's kicking from 40-50m out, which is where he seems to be kicking from mostly.

I think he needs to get a few marks closer to goal for his confidence, but that seems to be the space where Tabs is operating. It's a tricky one.

I do think Tabs has improved his kicking for goals. I wouldn't say I'm confident as he lines up, but it's no longer cushion over the face territory.
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cletus Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #37

cletus
It'd help a helluvalot Morgs if players would just concentrate on kicking drop punts inbetween the 2 big sticks! Concentrate on the point of release, the ball drop , and the follow through on the kick, could be 3 very simple things they could do.

This 'kicking around corners' carp, and banana kicks, etc - well..., it signals deficiency in the ability to kick a perfectly normal drop punt like they've been taught since they are 7 yrs old, rather than a 'special skill'

From a cricket background, its akin to a "Ryan Campbell 'Wow' shot one kneed, spreadeagled, back over the keepers head", where as, a Mark Waugh/Dean Jones very simple & safe legside glance, from off stump, could be just as effective, and hit to more variety of positions.

Its taking a lot of risk in comparison to doing something much simpler & more effective.

And its over complicating the skill set. Rather than just focusing on 1 very simple routine, reapeating & rinsing, they are dividing their goalkicking practice time into 3 or 4 different skill sets & routines.

It aint rocket science, and both Fyfe & Lobb should be sorting things out a lot quicker than they are. It should never have got to this point for both of them! It really is quite inexcusable for high paid, experienced, professional footballers.

Has Dave Mundy ever done a kick around a corner or off the outside of the boot set shot for goal? He probably has, but it'd be rare, and, there is a very good reason why.... he can kick perfect drop punts.!!

And with all the sports scientists & sports psychologists around the place, I am stunned that these goal kicking deficiencies are exhibiting themselves.
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Corporal Agarn said You Beaut

dddocker Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #38

dddocker
We need to employ Mitch Georgiades as our kicking for goal coach? Great balance and ball drop.
Obviously there is a difference between kicking for goal on the run and taking a kick for goal after a mark or free kick. It's the latter where we need to lift skills(technique). Practice, practice, practice!
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pollyanna Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #39

pollyanna
In an 18 team competition, if we're 1st for behinds we must be three goals better than someone. They add up, Fyfe just needs to add twenty more a game.
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Blue1red1, Raglan Matt said You Beaut

shane Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #40

shane
The kicking around corners nonsense has to have come from the three months Mark leCras was goal kicking coach. It's a sign that someone has no confidence in front of goals, which traditionally has been the first attribute you look for in a forward.
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blockerhall said You Beaut

Morgan Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #41

Morgan
To my eye, it looks like the kicking around the body from the pockets – off both feet – is much better than it was 20 years ago. Bananas look about the same. The kicking from straight in front looks worse.

Is there an angle where kicking around the corner becomes less accurate than a drop punt? It’s an interesting question. Fyfe gave it the corner jobby from straight in front and missed – but then he’d missed everything else as well – but it showed a bit where he confidence is at.

For all the advanced stats available in other sports, and the number of data people and assistant coaches in the AFL, there must be some data about which technique is best in which circumstance.
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Mushroom Hodor Appreciation Post 1 month 3 weeks ago #42

Mushroom
Fyfe kicked 1.4 on debut. The one was a part shank that went closer to the left post than the centre of the goals. You really reckon things are going to change drastically at this stage of his career, no matter how much practice he puts in?

I'm very happy we are getting the shots in. Makes a difference.
Very few behinds are rushed.
And we're getting another crack after the pressure set up half the time.

She's apples, mate.
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