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TOPIC: I've heard this somewhere before

Mike I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #1

Mike
After another terrific performance on the weekend, Max Gawn has been wheeled out before the media this week, and last night he was on AFL 360. When asked about the challenge he faced when first drafted, he said:

When I first got to the football club it was a very professional environment and I was a long way behind those first couple of years. Slowly I got there... but no-one can predict what AFL footy is going to be like. I use the analogy of private school versus public school. There’s not many public school boys in the AFL, there’s probably only four or five at our club at the moment. The difference is that private school kids are brought up in that professional environment.

This is something that has been referred to here quite a few times over the years, but what was especially interesting was that the two presenters were surprised by what he said. Others may have opinions on the intelligence of Gerard and Mark, but I find it hard to believe that people who are employed because of the AFL are not aware of this. In order to verify it I guess you would need to see some data, but what Gawn has said does seem to echo what has been observed by others.

Is is an issue? Do private schools recruit talented junior football players and thereby increase the likelihood of all the best players going through the private system? I have no idea. If clubs do prefer a certain educational model, it seems to me that they would be missing out on the many benefits of embracing diversity within a team environment. What does professionalism mean in this context anyway?
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shane I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #2

shane
Clubs prefer nice white kids who stand up straight and sit still for long periods while they drone on about middle aged coach things.
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The_Yeti, heycharger, DJKL, Raglan Matt said You Beaut

hypen I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #3

hypen
People send their kids to Trinity because of its football program. Taxpayers heavily fund these schools, not so they can lower their fees, they won't do that as it diminishes their brand, but so they can develop these programs even greater.

They are highly advanced football programs that prohibit any involvement in their community clubs past 15 years of age.
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goodie I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #4

goodie
It's an interesting topic. You would hope clubs look for kids with talent and then have enough faith in their own programs that they can look after kids that go off track. More importantly, and it's something I believe Freo does very well, is to direct players into studying at uni, or tafe courses that will help them when footy finishes. Character can't be defined by what type of school you went to. You meet plenty of dodgy types that went to Perth's best schools.
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut

Mike I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #5

Mike
If there is more footballing talent being funnelled into the private system, then I guess that's where you're going to focus your recruiting efforts.

What strikes me though is that I'm 100% certain that Jack Watts (who went to Brighton Grammar) benefits from having Max Gawn as a team-mate, and not just because Gawn is in terrific form, and indeed not just in a footballing sense either. And I have no doubt that Brighton Grammar (or Trinity, or wherever) is terrific - but society is great because people are different.
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Raglan Matt I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #6

Raglan Matt
The exact point I was going to make Goodie. Also recruits who have played senior footy at a young age are going to adapt to any system of coaching quicker than the plain vanilla "private school never seen the world outside his own little circle" types. The players who come through a pretty tough upbringing, and public school system, are also a fair bit more accustomed to being told they are wrong, or lazy, or lack skills and should do something about it if they want to reach the top level of their sport. This does not just apply to Footy either.
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jimb2 I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #7

jimb2
It takes more resources to run on a continuous improvement model rather than the old sink or swim model.
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Ricco I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #8

Ricco
Interesting phenomenon. I'm not sure it is just the private schools, but I think more and more future success in sport is correlated to family income and ability to support the child in that sport.

Take for example swimming - it costs a lot to do this regularly. To swim for a club, you could be looking at well over $1000 per year, maybe even $2K. Every now and again, you might get a kid that just jumps in the water and breezes past everyone else but that is the exception, not the rule. The reality is that most kids need to be funded for a number of years to get better. If you are comparing a 17 year old kid that has had $10,000 "invested" in his / her swimming over a number of years with regular training, against a kid that might swim for a school or at home a few times a year, chances are the kid with extensive practice will be better.

Same with team sports. Holiday programs are a few hundred dollars, good clubs demand higher fees etc etc and it becomes a self supporting prophecy.

It is the exception to find a Ronaldo hanging out in the favelas of Brazil, not the rule
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heycharger, rogerrocks said You Beaut

Morgan I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #9

Morgan
Perhaps the same trend would exist everywhere, but I’d have some hesitation in extrapolating from Melbourne Football Club to the rest of the AFL. They are the only AFL club with a slalom coach. It’s basically like saying Claremont prefers private school kids, therefore everyone in the WAFL does too.
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rogerrocks, Flag_2005 said You Beaut

shane I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #10

shane
Obviously the methodology is working because the drafting by the AFL clubs has been so successful over the past decade.
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut

lavo I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #11

lavo
A lot of kids also get picked up by the private schools from public (on scholarships etc) that do have talent. Played cricket at Perth juniors with a number of kids that were in that boat. Even at primary school we had scouts from Kent St checking out interschool games and offering spots. Community cricket now has the double whammy - private school kids put Darlot Cup (or whatever it is now) first, and District cricket has no requirements now that kids must also play for their local team. My son's team (Leeming Spartan), now will lose half of their under 15s side next season because of this, and the team will fold. Our oldest side will be under 14s, which means the seniors will have no new players from the juniors for quite a few years.

I can see the same thing happening to footy if this is the case.
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Raglan Matt I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #12

Raglan Matt
Footy is one of the few sports where you don't need a fortune behind you to succeed. Plenty of evidence exists to show that the kid from the wrong side of the tracks can make it if he makes full use of his skill, determination and perseverance.
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jezzaargh I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #13

jezzaargh
yep RM, Nic Nat is the exception that proves the rule, eh?
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heycharger I've heard this somewhere before 7 years 11 months ago #14

heycharger
What are the proportions in the Fremantle squad - public vs private education?

I would suspect it's a more even ratio than some teams - I'd imagine that your Melbournes, Carltons, etc would have a higher amount just because those teams were always more 'establishment'.

Obviously the corporate nature of modern clubs means that they will take the clean-cut well-educated kids over those with potential disadvantage in their backgrounds. Meanwhile they will have support programmes for indigenous players - understanding that this is necessary or their 'investment' in these players could be lost.

It could get to the stage one day that clubs have special support programmes for... bogans! Each club could have a few token outer suburban bogans on the list amongst all the white-toothed rich kids. The clubs would come to understand and respect their mullet hairdos and maverick ways.

Good on Max Gawn - for reminding us that at AFL level, footy loses its working class origins.
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