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TOPIC: Hawthorn Racism Review

jezzaargh Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #253

jezzaargh
We want the AFL to take a good hard look at itself and how it has dealt with racism in the past. Not because we want to trawl over 100 years of neglect, or conduct a witch-hunt or to bring legal claims, but because we want the AFL to be a safer place for our children

not that hard, is it?
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Walter the baker Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #254

Walter the baker
Sorry Polly. If anyone is after fresh buns they need to look somewhere else. My buns stopped being fresh about 30 years ago.

Onto the more serious matter. An update from the indigenous families from the ABC:


www.abc.net.au/news/2022-11-04/hawthorn-...estigation/101619792
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guy smiley Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #255

guy smiley
Crikey covered this yesterday...

One question I got asked in an interview crystallised the confusion for me. Doesn’t Amy have an obligation, having made her allegations, to “see them through” and give those accused of wrongdoing an opportunity to make their defence?

No, actually. Trauma victims have no obligations whatsoever, beyond protecting their own safety and well-being. She has spoken her truth and accepted the risks that entails. She has rights, which she is not obliged to pursue but may choose to in her own time. She has no duty to the AFL, no duty to help it enforce its own rules.

When the AFL asked Amy to participate in its process, we sent its lawyers a long letter setting out in detail every flaw in its design. It tried to address some of them in the next draft. The most important of our concerns it ignored or rejected. When it sent us the second draft, it wanted our response the next day. A day after that, it said it would be finalising the terms of reference with or without us. Which it did, publicly issuing final terms that are materially different from anything we’d seen.

Fundamentally, the process is not safe for the victims of abuse it will supposedly investigate. This breaks down into a number of basic failures, all of which we had pointed out.
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blockerhall, Bizkit, jezzaargh, pollyanna, Raglan Matt said You Beaut

Quasimodo Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #256

Quasimodo
Any inquiry needs to be fully independent of the AFL. The families should investigate if they have recourse through the human rights commission or the federal court. Then everyone can give testimony under oath be examined cross examined and learned judges can decide the matter.
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jezzaargh Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #257

jezzaargh
thanks Guy - hadn't seen that article, some great stuff in there. I particularly like this quote towards the end:

"what about the coaches, whose reputations have been besmirched? What about the presumption of innocence? What is Amy doing to respect their rights?

Nothing. She’s doing nothing. They’re big boys — white men — with access to every resource they could ever need to pursue and vindicate their rights."
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guy smiley, Bizkit said You Beaut

ManInPurple Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #258

ManInPurple
From what I can pick up, the AFL "independent' review is the only review being conducted. At the very least, it the only one really in the public spotlight.

Can someone explain to me why that's even acceptable, from a legal or government standpoint?

Shouldn't the review be completed by a higher body? Work Safe or the actual legal courts or a government inquiry team, not just a bunch of people that the AFL selected and paid for?

The AFL is an overarching company, with the individual clubs essentially the franchisees of that company.

If the same allegations were made against a Coles store (and were publicised to a similar extent), would the Head Huncho's over at Wesfarmers HQ be allowed to run their own "independent" review and then call the case closed? No. Work Safe would. Or one of the numerous layers of the Australian courts or somesuch.

What about a mining (or even worse: an oil and gas) company? Would the media, the general population, the government and the victims (the alleged victims at that point) be OK with that same company organising & paying for an "independent" review, and then call the case closed? Nope.

Or maybe thats exactly what does happen, and I just don't hear about it because the AFL is more high profile. Maybe I'm the one with my head in the sand and full of delusional fantacies. (Like that belief that every year for the last couple of decades pops up around now and lasts though to ~March that "this is the year" Freo wins the flag)
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shane Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #259

shane
www.abc.net.au/news/2022-10-02/worksafe-...llegations/101494426

Victoria's workplace safety watchdog has officially launched an investigation into allegations of discrimination at the Hawthorn Football Club.
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ManInPurple said You Beaut

fradonjan Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #260

fradonjan
hmmm so one abc link is ok but not others ?
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shane Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #261

shane
Well, my link was directly related to the post above it and filled them in on some information they had missed.

Your links were a month or older comments from Jeff Kennett, which I could not see any relevance to at this point in the discussion.

I really appreciate you giving me an opportunity to explain this to you rather than just moving on with your day.
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jezzaargh said You Beaut

fradonjan Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #262

fradonjan
I don't recall seeing all his comments posted here nor the other one about the black banners especially.
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guy smiley Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #263

guy smiley
The less Jeff Kennett the better, really.
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Quasimodo said You Beaut

jezzaargh Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #264

jezzaargh
forgive me, guy

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pollyanna Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #265

pollyanna
Pity they never corrected the sound image lag before uploading to YouTube - 6 frames is just bloody sloppy.
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hypen Hawthorn Racism Review 1 year 4 months ago #266

hypen
Fradojan, its very inconsistent and hard to know. The perils of posting links to the ABC i guess.

Its getting worse around here, I'm afraid.

Shane is looking at charging $7.99 per month for verfication. Thats the price of free speech in Australia - $7.99 per month. I'm just going to pay it knowing that some of the proceeds will go towards our Dockerland end of season trip to Mars.
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guy smiley, fradonjan said You Beaut