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TOPIC: Hogan

rogerrocks Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #99

rogerrocks
Shane, while it is not about winning or losing in the trade deals, it is important to get the best deal you can. If we sell the farm to get Hogan and he doesn't work out, we are in deep trouble. So even though its obvious we really need him, we can't act as though it matters that much. But I guess we have to give Melbourne enough so that they can get May - otherwise neither trade might happen.
I'd hate to be a list manager right now.
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jimb2 Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #100

jimb2
The secret to successful trading would be leaving the phrase "must have" to other teams.

We are actually in a strong position because we aren't having a crack at the big one for a few years so don't have a burning need for anyone to fill a particular slot. High picks are as good as established players to us. Desperate trader are not smart traders. We can afford to wait to trade, or, we can wait and see what our picks become. The key strategy is getting over the odds, not under.

In our earlier history I think we sometimes traded desperately, paying overs for players, expecting messiahs and getting naughty boys. Recently we've been smarter.
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browski, Mike said You Beaut

Morgan Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #101

Morgan
Part of the reason for hating the extended trade period is that I have a very limited tolerance for some of the buzzwords/phrases associated with trades. My least favourite is ‘wantaway’ - just an awful word. But close behind is ‘overs’, or its cousin ‘sell the farm’. None of these words really mean anything, because underpinning them is a subjective assessment on the value of the target.

No-one wants to pay ‘overs’ for Hogan, by definition. But what is his true value? Right now, that value depends on how healthy he is. I have no idea, and I doubt even Rosich or Bell know for certain.

But even if you know a player’s value, in deals like this you don’t always get what is fair – you get what you negotiate. The market for Hogan is shallow. From time to time I point out the disadvantages Freo often has to overcome in he AFL, but one of its few advantages is that in a two team town it has a good opportunity to capitalise on Western Australians who want to come home.

If Hogan was 100% healthy I would say our offer was insulting – including to Hogan himself – and lowballing Melbourne is probably not the way I would do the deal. But picks in the 5/6 range of this draft are incredibly valuable, so if there is any doubt about Hogan’s fitness then I would probably keep those off the table, and offering two first round picks at the lower end is probably a reasonable offer. Perhaps that’s where we are heading. I don’t know.
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jimb2, Bizkit, Flag_2005 said You Beaut

Leed Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #102

Leed
Well at least Morgan nobody has 'bought the farm'. That's a positive surely.
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pollyanna Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #103

pollyanna
Fair enough, there's no Red Book on player values. BUT, there's a definite structure to trading that is:

A. You get the player you need, you don't screw up the result; and:
B. You do the best deal you can, best price.

If you miss out on A then B is irrelevant. If you stuff up on B you miss out on being called a hero, no one will kick you in the teeth. Stuff up on A and getting repeatedly kicked in the teeth is the very best you can hope for.

Hoges is our guy, get the deal done or just head back to radio Belly.
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Davo, Corporal Agarn, themagoos said You Beaut

Corporal Agarn Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #104

Corporal Agarn
And while we still wait on this deal, we are still no closer to getting Lobb or perhaps Langdon.
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Morgan Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #105

Morgan
Freo's approach has waxed and waned a bit over time. We got caught out with Mitch Clark trying to squeeze Melbourne for a better deal. Then, for a few years Freo went into the trade period and did a lot of its business in the early days. It figured out what was about fair value, and did the deal in a pretty efficient way. B Hill was probably a good example of that. I can see the merit in that approach, and if I was hoping to be in the role for a long time, I think that would be my default position.

Then last year we stared down GC17 for the Weller deal. I thought at the time we were being unreasonable, but Freo got a great outcome. So what do I know?

I reckon our guys were a bit embiggoned by that. I'm hoping it doesn't come back to bite them, but I can't say for sure what the right way to approach this is.
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Gumnut Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #106

Gumnut
Trade radio just reporting that we have pulled out of the Jesse Hogan trade, quoting Belly.
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walba Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #107

walba
Agreed that buzzwords are irritating....except apparently “lowballing”.
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Morgan said You Beaut

pollyanna Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #108

pollyanna
What a bunch of fools.
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Corporal Agarn, themagoos said You Beaut

mac Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #109

mac
Melbourne has stated they happy to lose Hogan and Hogan is happy to come to Fremantle.
What is the other clubs offering for Hogan?
And West Coast not giving it any thought will have Melbourne having to take what we give them or
we can wait until next year.
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walba Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #110

walba
Not sure why there’s so much angst about giving up first round draft picks. The Dockers haven’t used them too well in the past.
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Gumnut Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #111

Gumnut
I think part of the problem as well is that Jesse still hasn't requested a trade. So until that occurred we couldn't sort out all the other trades. That has probably been holding up all our other prospective trades in Lobb, Langdon and anyone else.
At least now we can finalise Lobb and get to work on Langdon.
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The_Yeti said You Beaut

Corporal Agarn Hogan 5 years 7 months ago #112

Corporal Agarn
www.afl.com.au/news/2018-10-12/dockers-pull-out-of-hogan-chase

What ever happened to meeting in the middle?
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