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TOPIC: Forward Hope

Noddy Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #29

Noddy
So the moral of the saga is check your facts or face the fact checks where your cred may be burned. Bloody Lyon.
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Goober Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #30

Goober
I hope Apeness can stay injury free for the rest of the season and resurrect his career otherwise his future isn't looking good. Seven games in five seasons. If he is to be a ruckman, then he is competing with 5 others who don't get as injured as he does. You would think this would be his last chance if he gets another long term injury. If he stays fit for a good length of time then we can see how good he really is.
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The_Yeti, Suker said You Beaut

purplepower Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #31

purplepower
Results are a fact
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Bizkit Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #32

Bizkit
I never mentioned anything about what position Apeness played before being drafted Jezza (it was majority forward with stints in the ruck in case you were unaware and missed his games). What I referred to was the way he was talked up and positioned once drafted by Freo which you completely threw out the window and ignored in order to take cheap shots at me and defend RL. RL by his own admission has nothing to do with drafting so what position he played before then would be irrelevant in that discussion anyway.

The point is he was drafted as a forward with repeated interviews declaring him a forward and showering praise on his ability to mark the ball and play as a KPF. I agreed with this sentiment and still do, he's a fantastic mark and exactly the type of key tall we need up forward to make a contest and bring the ball to ground against the biggest defenders.

All of a sudden we now have RL spinning things differently to the first few years Apeness was at the club and declaring him a ruckman (which at 200cm he is undersized and not able to compete against the best). A complete 180 like this makes me ask a lot of questions, especially when he spent so long trying to convince us he was something else. I'm not a fan of the lying and deception, especially when it seems aimed at the fans and keeping them on side with his agenda. I'm not that easily bought.

Now Apeness has been declared a ruckman in waiting and he goes out this weekend to lead the ruck on his own (and I think a smaller, more mobile ruckman like Grundy is a better initial match up for Apeness if he is fit after all his leg injuries) and struggles, he cops more criticism than he should as a forward who can compete in the ruck similar to a Jenkins at Adelaide or Patton at GWS.

RL gets away with selecting an injury prone player in an unnatural position just to get by till his proper ruckman are back from injury instead of playing one of the actual ruckman we selected last draft or should have been selecting the past few years. Cox/Fyfe are not a good combo in reserve either with both at risk of injury and needed more urgently elsewhere but that is the role Apeness should be playing.

Just in case you're still wondering where I got the impression Apeness was Pav's replacement or 'the Messiah', I spent 2 min googling to find these:

"The two flavours at the moment are ruck-forwards, because you can only play one ruck, and big mids. So Michael's a rare commodity in the draft.''

At 200cm and 105kg, Apeness was viewed as the long-term replacement for retired forward Matthew Pavlich.

Luckless Fremantle Dockers forward Michael Apeness looks likely to return for Peel Thunder... but has played just two games for the Dockers after injuries derailed the initial stages of his career. In those two games Apeness showed an aggressive presence in the forward line, making an impact...

Young Fremantle forward Michael Apeness has signed a new deal which will see him remain at the club until the end of the 2018 season.

He even debuted as a late replacement for Pav!
Nathan: When did you get balls?
Simon: I've always had balls you've just never seen them.
Nathan: That's the gayest thing I've ever heard.
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blockerhall said You Beaut

Davo Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #33

Davo
200cm is undersized for a ruckman???
Lucky for Sean Darcy he is 201cm then.
Apeness is more than tall enough.
Taberner at 199cm is the backup ruck.

But don't let the facts get in the way of a good story...
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Jezza, Noddy, Lazza040, Suker said You Beaut

Davo Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #34

Davo
We only drafted Apeness because McCarthy was drafted 3 picks beforehand by GWS. We would never have drafted the Ape otherwise.

Ironic that Freo now has both players.

Is he a ruck or forward, who cares? You have to play both positions anyway these days if you're any decent height.
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Suker said You Beaut

Bizkit Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #35

Bizkit
He's the right height for a pinch hitting ruckman who is mostly stationed forward as I mentioned but not a lead ruck with ruckmen these days generally being over 205cm. Darcy has more weight on him which helps a lot and has probably grown since those stats were taken. In any case he is more effective at ball ups and boundary throw ins where it's more of a wrestle and he can use his weight and footy smarts opposed to centre bounces.
Nathan: When did you get balls?
Simon: I've always had balls you've just never seen them.
Nathan: That's the gayest thing I've ever heard.
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Raglan Matt Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #36

Raglan Matt
Bringing up Darcy's name reminds me that last year he was a new recruit who was a complete unknown to most of us at this time of the season. Sandi got injured, and instead of trying to turn one of our forwards into a ruckman, to cover until Sandi got back, we threw a fella who had been recruited as a ruckman into the game. Look what the result was. New hope for Freo about life after Sandi.

Now is the perfect time to pick another young ruckman (we have a few to choose from) and see what he has got, give him a role leading the ruck and use Sandi as the second tall forward/relieving ruck. Bring in Apeness as the tall forward and release McCarthy up the ground. Hell, Cammac may be the Johnno replacement, try him in that role for a week or 2 and bring Kersten in to play where we recruited him for.

Has Kersten ever played in a Freo team without McCarthy? And how was his performance?

Yeti, I agree with your take on the defensive mindedness of Lyon, but in Bond we have another who is of the same mind, and it does not bode well for a change in style any time soon. As for Barlow, with the young mids we have coming through, I think the powers that be thought that for Mike to get a game he had to play some other position for the future. I think they got that right personally, in the first part, but wrong in where they tried to play him. He should have been played closer to goal where his smarts and accurate but distance limited kicking and strong contested marking could be used to advantage. Oh, I see the problem with that theory already.
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Docker by the Sea Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #37

Docker by the Sea
What I noticed at the weekend was our inability to string possessions together at all.
I did notice that Ben Brown was always kept deeper than our forwards, but was never stationed inside the forward fifty as many would have you believe.
The problem equally existed trying to exit North Melbourne’s fifty as other areas of the field. It looked to Norths were willing to concede numbers at the contest and congestion to be positioned with extra numbers at the fall of the ball.
Maybe this is why we win so much of the clearance battle and lose the war.
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jimb2 Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #38

jimb2
I would have thought that the positions players play would be an ongoing consideration by the coaches and senior players based on the team's needs and the player's skills and performance. This might be possibly be influenced by the players preference, though this is a bit chicken and egg, the player will want to play where they are needed and where their skills fit.

The idea that Ross sits in the bath for an hour meditating then declares that some player is a ruckman - or whatever -forever is a cranky fairytale.
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Suker Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #39

Suker
Thanks Jim...I now have the image of Wrinkly Ross in the bath with all those rubber duckies floating around.
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guy smiley, Raglan Matt said You Beaut

shane Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #40

shane
I suppose the problem with stating that everything is well thought out and best practice is always followed is that we haven't looked like being competitive for two and half years now.

Someone must be doing something wrong.
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goodie, Bizkit, DazzElle, Raglan Matt, Lazza040, Corporal Agarn, themagoos said You Beaut

expat Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #41

expat
Ross in the tub and a few boxes of Radox to atleast turn back the clock to 2013
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blockerhall Forward Hope 5 years 11 months ago #42

blockerhall
Jezza, FFS.

You ignore the freo rhetoric from the club itself, listing him as a forward option first, and put up AFL background as your defense?
He has been consistently played forward when he plays, until this year. We are ONLY hearing his ruck stats in the last month- why is that exactly?

Because he hasn't been rucking. In the WAFL. In his career. In 34 WAFL games, 219 hitouts. Last 4 games-121 of those. That's 30 games for 98 hit outs prior, at you know, a bit over 3 a game. For a ruckman playing at Fremantle's direction?

Your revisionism is breath-taking.

Of course the reality is that Apeness was still seen as a forward to come good until 4 weeks ago down at Dooker Central, Darcy went down, we looked around, went "Oh S#@$", realised Meeks and Jones weren't ready, forgot that we had delisted Griffin and Clarke, and saw a tall guy running around the paddock, and told him to ruck at Peel
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