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Early Days and March Premiers

TOPIC: Early Days and March Premiers

Noddy Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #29

Noddy
I thought the way the Dogs got through last years finals series was similar to Freo when we were at our best, high defensive pressure with good use of the ball.
Roly just needs to sort out whose up to the level of competence required.
Was it Hawthorn, Sydney and the GWS game plan that saw them lose in Rd 1?
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Awake Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #30

Awake
Pretty sure it was the Crystal Palace plan that did them in.
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Morgan Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #31

Morgan
Assessing the efficacy (or even existence) of game plans when a team plays poorly is tough. But one thing can be instructive – where are our players grouped on the ground? For all the talk of Lyon not changing, Shane’s point about our defense is relevant. In the past Lyon has been pretty conservative and put numbers in the backline. He’s copped a fair whack for that on here in the past. I didn’t see that very much against Geelong. So, if we don’t have numbers back, where are they?

It appeared to me that we had more numbers in the midfield. We also seemed to have more options forward than we had in the past. Now, those options weren’t always great, but relative to previous seasons we seemed to have more people forward, and relatively few times when our forward 50 was empty. I also thought we did a pretty good job of switching the play when we did win the ball in the backline. We had more uncontested possessions and more inside 50s, so that suggests to me we were throwing the ball around a little more.

But for every change there is a trade-off, and in our case, it was we didn’t have nearly as much protection for our backline. That meant that when we turned it over – which was often – we were scored on heavily. We don’t have McPharlin or a younger Johnson to clown forwards and send the ball pinging the other way.

So, I actually think Lyon has made moves in the right direction, but the execution was poor. Were our bad skills a round-one aberration, or are we going to turn it over all season and get torched the other way? Will Lyon lose his mettle and put player back? Will Johnson return to form and Hamling play well enough to justify the risk of an open backline? I have no idea.

But I’m not sure you can say it is ‘more of the same’ as last season. We’re bad in a different way.
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Jezza Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #32

Jezza
Morgan, that's the best analysis I've read since Sunday's loss. The so called experts couldn't have put it any better. And that's where Roly put his hand up and admitted he *uc*ed up. Take the scores from turnovers out (7.2), suddenly that so called game plan looks bloody good. That's 44 points against. Which is about what we lost by.
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rogerrocks said You Beaut

Drubbing Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #33

Drubbing
How often is Lyon getting a free pass for admitting he's an idiot?

Words are often put in my mouth when criticising his game. Just because I don't believe it works doesn't mean defence isn't important. But he builds everything around that. And even that isn't working.

Skilled cattle seems to mean little to him. The most basic skills and structure hasn't improved one bit - from blokes playing together for years. So either he can't coach it, or can't be bothered. We get the same confused, disorganised crap every year.

Attack is important or you've no score to defend. But for years the approach is disorganised and opportunistic, so no surprise Walters is a consistent provider, as small forward create something from nothing.
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Bizkit said You Beaut

jimb2 Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #34

jimb2
Realistically, if we won 4 games last year and we are on a four year rebuild anything above 8 games this year is a bonus. [covers head]
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Noddy Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #35

Noddy
I'm not sure an AFL coach can 'coach' elite skills into all of their players. For example, for a period Mayne was very good at kicking for goal but that skill left him, for years.
Ultimately, it's the ability to consistently produce all the skills required in AFL which will determine how good a player is whether marking, hand balling or kicking and sometimes these skills go missing and at the worst moments in a match.
I think Lyon does a good job with the list he's got.
If you are an AFL coach you better have a short haircut for match days.
I may be wrong but I think Geelong were reported as having slightly more critical errors in the match than us...hard to believe. Most of ours must have occurred in critical areas and at critical times.
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Corporal Agarn Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #36

Corporal Agarn
So Noddy you're saying that if Lyon's done a good job with the list he's got, the in all the time he's been there he and and his recruiting team have failed in their job.
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Drubbing Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #37

Drubbing
'Elite'? I'd settle for competent skills after 5 Lyon years.

I've had zero coaching, but can handpass to someone right next to me. I must be expecting too much for Lyon to get more from blokes paid to do it full time.
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cletus said You Beaut

Noddy Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #38

Noddy
Apart from A Pearce as what I think will be an elite backman I think we've failed to secure a big key forward....but everyone knows that. I don't think the coach has a huge input to recruiting but relies on others doing the research. The CEO and Board have a bit to answer for.
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Noddy Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #39

Noddy
Drubbing I understand your annoyance, I'm with you on that, all I'm trying to say is that Lyon can't be accountable for every brain block and skill error by players in a game, particularly the experienced guys.
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Suker Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #40

Suker
Mmm, I reckon that we are all ok with young players making errors, but having a real crack, taking some risk. But being encouraged to do so. That is after all how confidence is developed. I am sure we have plenty of skill, but when confidence and understanding of the game style are low, then the skills will suffer.
And I am sure we have less tolerance for experienced 200 game players making crucial errors more than once, gifting goals and opportunities to opposition. Why? Is it confidence as well?
Did we see much joy in our players apart from Langdon's first goal celebration? Is it a happy camp down there? A happy work environment nearly always starts from the top down...is it happening at Freo?
Being in that team must be puzzling for some of the newer players when selection doesn't seem to based on current form. I love Suban, he gives everything, but he was not the ideal replacement for Ballas. he got 12 touches the week before and lacks a bit of pace. Balic played well, Crozier played ok, hughes was good...but nuh, we went for Suban who has never really been a small forward anyhow. Puzzling.
And it seems that the two fisted spoil of an uncontested ball coming in a head height is an ok way to attack the game. Meanwhile we have a 194cm young defender who can kick, mark and handball, and crash a pack with strength and intent, being in the best players in the wafl...but seems to be no chance to come into the team barring injury to others.
Puzzling, very puzzling.
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walba, Corporal Agarn said You Beaut

purplepower Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #41

purplepower
Bond has a lot more to answer than Lyon...
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Noddy Early Days and March Premiers 7 years 4 weeks ago #42

Noddy
I think Suban was played for some experience and hardness at the contest. It wasn't a good day all round for high fives or slaps on the back. Walters had 8 disposals for 1 goal while Sudan had 10 for 1.

When there were as many turnovers as we had and some guys are busting their bags to win the pill I doubt you'll see many party poppers going off in the breaks or after goals....we were never in the party room.
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