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TOPIC: Rebuilding

Docker by the Sea Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #15

Docker by the Sea
Jezza I love your endless optimism, unfortunately this year it has deserted me. I for one hope that you are right.
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The_Yeti Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #16

The_Yeti
Jezza,

try reading what I actually wrote. I didn't criticise him for 'not playing the kids', I criticised him for mishandling their development. I also didn't say anything about Apeness. I'm happy for him to play as a backup ruck but thats got nothing to do with what i actually said about Tabs which was 1 week in and 3 weeks out is poor for his development. Proof of the pudding is how well he's played when given a lengthier stint. Even the best don't play at their best in their first week back into a side. If Roly can't understand that, then yes he's the wrong man for the job.

Your comments about Fyfe, Neal and Cammac are arrant nonsense. There has been no indication anywhere that Roly is the reason they want to be at Fremantle, so you are simply making stuff up there.

Taking a team from minor premiers to be a projected 4 - 5 years at the wrong end of the ladder is simply not the mark of a good coach. Failing to address obvious deficiencies in our play is not the mark of a good coach. Being able to adapt somebody else's game plan is not the mark of the good coach. Not being able to develop a plan B in the light of new rules is not the mark of a good coach.

As for there being a better coach out there? I largely suspect there are but they need to be identified. Even Clarkson was an unknown when he was an assistant coach.

Next year will be the proof of these criticisms. If Roly cannot come to grips with the new rules while others like Roos, Simpson (yuck), Clarkson, etc can then I dare say there will be a lot of better coaches around than Roly...just like there was this season.
Egurls Suck!
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Lazza040, Down on down said You Beaut

goodie Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #17

goodie
Lyon has questions to answer over this year but it's the list management team that should have their heads on the chopping block.
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Corporal Agarn Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #18

Corporal Agarn
List management! Roly has managed to grease his way out of that one. In his own words.."how am I supposed to know about list management."
Classic deflective spin doctor speak.
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Down on down said You Beaut

Jezza Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #19

Jezza
I'm happy to be corrected, and I'm as gutted as the next docker supporter, but if Roly was the coach who hadn't met all your expectations, there's not many that would. Don't even put Simpson in the same sentence as Clarkson. Eagles supporters was calling for his head in his first season. Furthermore, the great man Pav, speaks highly of Roly, in his book. Surely you're not doubting our messiah. Our view from the outside is influence by the media most times. In this town, if you do it long enough, it'll brainwash you.
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rogerrocks said You Beaut

pollyanna Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #20

pollyanna
Nope. I sit at Subi and watch them get worse and worse - any coach (and I mean any) would be able to get something going. He hasn't and they've got no one on the field. I've seen good footballers turned into fumbling fools, I've seen promising talent turned into colts players. I've watched, week by week, that old fool laughing in the coaches box and then doing his wobbly-wobbly eye thing at pressers. The following week, we play even worse than the one before.

The media has given him a very, very soft run.
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The_Yeti, Bizkit, purplethai, DazzElle, Lazza040, Down on down, Raybeez said You Beaut

rogerrocks Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #21

rogerrocks
Polly, if its like that in the 2nd half of next season, I'll concede. But right now I've still got my rose coloured glasses on.
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The_Yeti Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #22

The_Yeti
Again, I'm with Polly on this one.

I've also sat at Subi and watched 2nd rate teams pick our defense apart and over 3 or more seasons there has been no answer from Roly. We defend in zones and other teams wait until we set our zone then run into space for a short kick receive.

Even the crap teams try to do that to us and they are generally successful until they fluff it. Good teams like Hawthorn just keep doing it and don't fluff it much.

If I can see this happening, how come Roly can't?

If I can see how Tabs benefits from continuous games, how come Roly can't?

If I can see how our skills have been poor for years and yet not see those skills being addressed. I have to ask myself why aren't they being addressed.

As Polly says, we are seeing promising talent turned into utter scrubbers and then getting delisted. I've seen Barlow played out of position into a situation where he is grossly unsuited and for this piece of mismanagement, Barlow gets sent to Peel but the bloke who mismanaged him, gets more adoring kool aid drinkers talking him up.

I can see these problems, why can't a 'genius' coach or maybe he's just got his rep from following Roo's game plan.
Egurls Suck!
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Burton said You Beaut

Jezza Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #23

Jezza
People are acting as if we've hit rock bottom. The Connolly era was rock bottom. I sit in the stands and watch the same games as you Polly. I've wrecked my brain trying to fathom the type of footy they've dished up since Rd.1 I don't know what the answer is but I do know that Roly can and will turn this around. He's got 4 years.
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Docker by the Sea Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #24

Docker by the Sea
It is hard to judge from outside but someone or something has drained any semblance of confidence out of the playing group. Serviceable players are struggling Ro tie their laces at the moment. I am willing to give Roly the benefit of the doubt at the moment, it is one poor year. There are very few signs of improvement, other than flashes of ball movement. Even this however, I am not sure if it is different ball movement than 12 months ago, or we have got that horrible that anything looks good.
We will need to show measurable and marked improvement next year or the pressure will come and deservedly so. Currently we are one of those teams with no discernible way we want to play. Other teams seem to know what we want to do and either pay no heed to it or are very confident that they can break it down and beat it. From my viewing they know withstand the initial heat then win the game. This used to result in narrow wins now it results in thrashing sin which we can't score.
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DS Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #25

DS
Early in his career Malthouse was quite successful. Then the game went past him and he was unable to adapt. He ended up looking like an old fool who used diversionary tactics to deflect blame from himself. It is starting to look like Roly is heading the same way.
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Morgan, Corporal Agarn said You Beaut

guy smiley Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #26

guy smiley
You're a brave man talking about brainwashing, Jezza...

you've done a fairly good job of being a spokesman for the brainwashed in all of these Roly debates and I'm not having a go at you in that, your optimism and team spirit is to be admired.

When it's not giving me a dead set case of the Thai chillies after too many Changs, that is... due to my complete disillusionment with FFC and its head coach..

This IS rock bottom mate. Freo have had one season in their history with worse results. Consider that history... and consider what it takes to be a contender for worst year ever within that. Then consider the result last year... if you're the sort that looks only at results instead of trends. Although they limped home, they finished on top a year ago and the fall from that achievement is... no-one has fallen further or harder. Ever. This year, injuries aside, is the culmination of a trend. You could even include the injuries as part of the overall trend because the soft tissue management of Freo players has been a major bone of contention for years...

but the pattern has been apparent for the last couple of years at least. As impressive as Roly's game plan appears at first, as many have said it's limited, severely so due to the demands it places on players' running and the sheer neglect of skills development.

you yourself outlined why Roly's argument rings hollow at best and more like a freshly whacked turd at worst... the sheer talent at his disposal is impressive and he's talking rebuild. A team of players good enough to grab a minor flag last year is suddenly no good. If I was a player singing the praises of a bloke so ready to shaft me and my group in public to justify his own non performance then I reckon I'd need my head read.

I don't want to be rude... yes, I do. It's ingrained in every cell in my DNA to be honest, so I'll just put it out there...

it's time to wake up and smell the bacon on the breeze.
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Quasimodo Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #27

Quasimodo
This has been our worst year since 2001.

The fall from minor premier to our current form unacceptable.

The coaches and football management are to blame.

We didn't anticipate how this seasons rule changes would affect our game style which is now obsolete The players lack direction and there is no coherent game plan they move the ball from one pressure point to another with no consistency. The backline has no leadership or vision of what's up the field. The midfield other than Neale don't win the hard ball and don't work together to win the ball. Our forwards other than Walters can't seem to read the play up the ground and anticipate where tge ball is going, probably moe Walters skill and the unpredictable disposal of the midfield than the fault of the forwards.

The lack of cohesion has led to a loss in morale, the blokes drop off effort by mid way second quarter and then we are swamped. I think it is more mental effort than physical effort that causes our fades, some of the guys give up you can see it in the body language.

This is a hard fix. Lyon and his coaches need to work out a coherent game plan in line with contemporary rules so the players can succeed they need to sell this Mundy and the leadership team who then need to win the players to this. It can be done Lyon did it in 2012/13. But this time it will be harder he has to win back the trust and respect of the players so they buy in. If not the emperor is clothes less

Our recruitment strategy needs a serious rethink. We seem to pick without really analysing what we need. We grab guys with skill in many areas but not specialised. You need to look at what position are you trying to fill what are the key skills needed in that position and who shows them best.

Look at Kennedy he can read the play in front him, is therefore quick for 5m takes a good mark and can kick 50m accurately. He only needs those 3 skills we try to fit in more that are useless to the position and then compromise what we need. Our recruiters need more focus.

If Lyon can't show a good improvement by round 11 2017, by that we need to have won 5-7 games perhaps we can lure Roos out of retirement and get the real deal rather than the cheap facsimile.
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Raglan Matt said You Beaut

Jezza Rebuilding 7 years 8 months ago #28

Jezza
I'll cop the pasting on trying to put a case for the defence, with evidence that are flimsy at best. It wouldn't be the first time where the case was full of holes. However, if getting rid of Roly would solved our problem, I'm on board. The alternative is to refresh our list with players that can perhaps adapt to the game plan consistently. The list adapted for 4 years, now it's over. We were so close to achieving success. History will show that the list was guided by Roly and all I know is that he's staying and a dozen or so players are going. I'm in for the next chapter.
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Docker by the Sea said You Beaut
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